Asking for Help with Amy Bryant

I am excited to connect you with my one of my best friends since 8th grade, Amy Bryant. She is a professional, licensed counselor and has been integral in helping me with all kinds of things I have struggled with over the years.

Most recently Amy and I have been discussing neurodiversity and how different people’s brains work. This is another reason why we focus a whole month on mental health. I never want anyone to feel alone, and a lot of people feel different or awkward and this can make them feel isolated.

My brain works different than others but as a kid I thought I wasn’t as smart as others. Amy has a heart for helping people who are hurting and she makes a huge difference to the clients she works with and their families. It is important to ask for help, professional help. It is also important to know that everyone is different. We don’t have to fit into the same boxes. For us creatives this is a superpower and helps us in our jobs. We just have to embrace it.

Episode 457 Aired LIVE on January 17, 2024 at 7:30 pm GMT / 2:30 pm ET / 11:30 am PT / 9:30 am in Hawaii

Amy’s Notes

Neurodiversity is the ways people Think, Move, Communicate, Behave, Visualize and Process information.

Neurodivergence simply means the brain works differently from how society says it should work. And so we’re often told from VERY young ages that we are Lazy, Slackers, Bad, Stupid, Unmotivated, Not trying, Not working hard, Dreamers, Procrastinators, Spastic, Spacy, Too Much, A Lot, etc.

Neurodivergent people have strengths and challenges. 

• The challenges are usually pathologized and the focus is usually fixing/changing
• Versus minimizing the impact of the challenges by finding helpful supports

Executive functions are cognitive processes necessary to control attention, thoughts, emotions, behaviors and memory – it’s the management part of our brain. It helps us start tasks, complete tasks, execute multiple step projects in order, get organized, stay organized, up-regulate or down-regulate our energy so we can get something done, and regulate our emotions as we deal with the ups and downs of every day life. 

ADHD (poorly titled attention deficit hyperactivity disorder) actually just means that the executive center of your brain has difficulty regulating your attention, energy and emotions. So you might have difficult starting and/or completing a task, getting and/or staying organized, executing a multi-step project (like making a sandwich or putting a powerpoint presentation together), regulating your emotions or impulses, and more!

This doesn’t mean you are a bad person, you are “too much” or “lazy” or “unmotivated” or “lazy,” it just means that your brain has strengths in other areas, like creativity or interpersonal relationships or thinking outside the box, but needs more support in these areas.

In order to ask for help, we first need to get clear on our strengths and identify things we find more difficult. We can explore these things with a therapist or an executive functioning coach, or we can get really curious over the course of a week or two and some reflection time…when we remember!

Know Your Strengths

• What do you look forward to?
• What’s easy to start?
• What’s easy to accomplish or complete?
• What do you LOVE to do, talk about, read about, or learn about?

examples: conceptualizing projectings, creating websites, sketching, talking to people, making IG posts, etc.
Know What You Find Challenging

• What is difficult for you to start?
• What is difficult to return to in order to finish it?
• What do you dread doing, even if you have the skill?
• What do you stop and start that feels effortful?
• What feels effortful, even if you have the ability to do it?

examples: logos, taxes, billing, making a sandwich, remembering to eat or pee, taking a shower, responding to emails, etc.
**Just knowing these things is a HUGE start! Spend a week or month getting really curious about YOU without judgment. This is how your brain works, and we can be kind and compassionate to ourselves and break down the untrue labels that have been slapped on us.***

What To Do Next

• What can you assign to someone else? (CPA, client, partner/spouse, colleague, friend, etc.)
• Set yourself up for success: know and accept your limits! (phone reminders, grab and go food, snacks and water at your desk, body doubling for tedious “must do” tasks)
• Be kind and compassionate to YOU!
  • You are not lazy. These are brain functions, and you have no control over the kind of brain you have – and your brain has plenty of STRENGTHS, even if it struggles with executive functions. We ALL have something.
  • The world’s expectations are unrealistic. You are the adult in charge of your life and you get to create the parameters around your ife – set realistic expectations that lean into your strengths, your capacity and your ability. 

Overall, there are LOTS of ways to ask for help, and the first step is to get clear on what comes natural to you, what is more difficult, and then identifying what you can *and really would be happier if * you asked for support and/or passed it along. So while a therapist or executive functioning coach could be helpful, it’s also really helpful to ask for help from the everyday people in your lives: friends, family, clients, bosses, etc.

• “It’s important to me that I send you this information we’ve discussed, so please send me an email reminding me what it is.” (client)
• “I know I can get this project done, but I will need someone else to take care of xyz so that I can do my best work.” (boss)
• “I know that putting things away isn’t my strong point. I’m wondering if you can be the “putter awayer” and I can be the (ask your spouse, partner, etc. what’s difficult for them – something that is not also difficult for you – and insert it here)” (partner/spouse)
• “I love when we get together. You’re really good at finding places, and I’m wondering if that’s easy for you because it’s really difficult for me. Then I could make sure to remind us and schedule it.” (friend/partner/spouse)

I hope you will join me as I share what I have uncovered. This month we focus on mental health. I will tell you what’s coming up. I will be LIVE on Wednesday, Jan 17, 2024 at 7:30pm GMT / 2:30pm ET / 11:30am PT / 9:30am in Hawaii. Sign up to get the link at https://creativesignite.com/signup

You can always join us for the live taping experience and be part of the community. Come a little early and introduce yourself in the chat, tell us where you are located in the world and say hey!  

Listen here

Questions

1. Amy, can you give everybody a little background about you, what you do, and how we know each other? 
   
2. For the show I use January to focus on mental health each year. You have been great at helping me understand better ways to ask questions, better ways to talk to clients or students about conflicts, and you have helped me to understand ADHD and the executive functioning issues I have better. What other things have you seen in other creatives or in entrepreneurs about how to maintain a better balance?
   
3. I know my ADHD diagnosis was helpful to me in many ways. It gave me understanding about things that I have struggled with my whole life. How have you seen other adults handle a diagnosis of being neurodivergent?
   
4. I have struggled to understand what is meant by executive function. What does it really mean? 
   
5. When our business is pivoting or we are trying out a new style or even a new side project/hustle, we can go to a dark place because we are experiencing failure. For some of us who have owned our businesses for over 10 or 20 years, feeling like a rookie can be uncomfortable.
   
6. Honestly I can’t remember all I wanted to talk about. You have given me such great advice over the years and I just wanted you to share some of that knowledge. So here’s a few topics we talked about before.
   

• ADHD
• Executive Functions
• Time-Blindness
• Work-arounds for things we struggle with
• Changing old habits so we are working more healthily

Here’s a little more about Amy.

Amy Bryant, MS, EdS, LPC a licensed and board certified mental health therapist dedicated to helping women and emerging adults (age 15+) struggling with social and test anxiety, depression, OCD, High Sensitivity (HSP), overwhelm, self-esteem, chronic pain, gastrointestinal issues, insomnia, and navigating the world with a neurodivergent brain. She also helps parents and professionals who live or work with kids and teens who struggle with OCD, school refusal, suicidal ideation, cutting and other forms of NSSI, anxiety, depression, and trying to figure out their place in the world, plus those who are exploring their sexual and/or gender identity. Amy is LGBTQ+ and Neurodivergent affirming and inclusive, and always learning more.

Connect with Amy

Website: WildChildCounseling.com

IG: @WildChildATL

FB: https://www.facebook.com/wildchildcounseling/

Email: amy@WildChildCounseling.com

Transcript

[00:00:00] diane: I was about to say happy birthday. That is not, it is not your birthday yet, Amy. Um, but it’s my dog growing up. Her birthday is today. Um, she’s obviously not with us anymore. ’cause I had her when I was, I don’t know what grade, fifth grade maybe I got her and then she died when we were seniors. Amy and I have known each other since we were 13.

[00:00:28] Yeah. All the awkward [00:00:30] stages. Hey, Maura Maura’s here. She’s in Raleigh, North Carolina. Carrie, Carrie, North Carolina. Same. 

[00:00:35] Amy Bryant: I have a friend near Carrie. Yeah. 

[00:00:37] diane: Yeah. Anyway, me and Amy played soccer. I didn’t do much playing. Amy did much playing. Um. Amy was a much better player than was me, but I was a good cheerleader on the side.

[00:00:49] So we have lots of old stories, but that’s not what we’re here for. One, one of the wonderful things about having a friend who’s also a therapist [00:01:00] is that you can ask them questions about things that you’re struggling with or like, why are something happening like this, or, and one of the things that I’ve learned a lot about recently is just the, just about, um, having a neuro divergent brain, and I didn’t know what that was.

[00:01:22] I didn’t even know I had a DHD, I’m sure. People who were therapists knew I had a DHD, but um, I [00:01:30] officially got diagnosed five years ago, I think is when it was. Mm-Hmm. So Amy, this is Amy Bryant. She is a professional counselor, licensed therapist, whatever. Right. There’s lots of ways to say it. Mm-Hmm. But she knows what she’s talking about.

[00:01:44] She’s also, um, she is real and isn’t gonna sugarcoat it. I was about to say color code it, but maybe not color coded either. But we might. 

[00:01:58] Amy Bryant: We might. But there 

[00:01:59] diane: are [00:02:00] lots of things that I’ve felt comfortable enough to ask Amy about, because we have a long history, but I also know what she’s focused on and so she does.

[00:02:10] Why don’t you tell ’em, Amy, welcome to Creatives Ignite. Thank you. Why don’t you tell ’em a little bit about you and you’re in Atlanta. 

[00:02:19] Amy Bryant: I am. I’m in Atlanta and Diana and I. Both a DHD and we have a long history, so we will do our best to, to keep it on [00:02:30] topic and minimize our storytelling about each other and ourselves except where it’s pertinent.

[00:02:36] Um, so yes, I’m in Atlanta. Um, my business is Wild Child counseling. I, um, mostly work with families who have an identified wild child. So this, they’re, they’re having struggles that show up either in wild behaviors or school refusal or things like that. But also, um, it’s about that own wild child within us, [00:03:00] which is super relevant to those of us who suddenly discover in their forties and fifties or if you’re lucky, teenagers and twenties, that you’re neurodivergent that there’s something going on different about us that makes us feel like maybe we’re wild when really we’re just outside sort of that status quo.

[00:03:20] diane: But maybe it’s also about, um, we might think about wild as being defiant maybe, or Sure. Not. [00:03:30] Um, but I also think that creatives, we kind of don’t really fit in the box for normal Absolutely. People lots of times. Mm-Hmm. So we are already on the outs. Right. Hyperactive, um, Marissa, so we have maybe more energy.

[00:03:42] Yeah. Mm-Hmm. Um, we solve problems differently. Mm-Hmm. I think just as creatives, but some of that can be obviously frustrating to a parent who’s trying to get, um, Amy, I do think you were my wildest friend. I was like, [00:04:00] not wild. I think, I don’t think I was wild. Do you think I 

[00:04:04] Amy Bryant: was wild? You were wild in your own way.

[00:04:07] Yeah. You were uninhibited in ways that perhaps were different from other people. I. I was thinking about you on the soccer sidelines cheering us on like you were an animal wildcat. Yes, it was. I can see here and feel it. So it’s amazing. I don’t 

[00:04:22] diane: think of that as wild. I guess I was just enthusiastic. 

[00:04:26] Amy Bryant: You were incredibly, wonderfully enthusiastic.

[00:04:29] [00:04:30] Yes. Okay, so, 

[00:04:31] diane: but how, um. One of the things that I asked you recently was like, okay, everybody’s talking about this executive functioning. I honestly am a little offended with the whole executive. Like, IM like, I’m like, what? I can’t be a CEO then, or I’m stuck in a secretary job. Or like, it is offensive in a way.

[00:04:52] So I also was part of a group one time and they put me and some of my friends in this group called Discovery, and I’m like, dude, I [00:05:00] have had a business for 20 years. I do not think I’m in discovery, but I, we just embraced it and laugh about it and we’re fine. Like it should have been group A, you know, like don’t, yeah.

[00:05:10] Put people, whatever. Anyway, that’s my own little thing, but, Mm-Hmm. For exec. I don’t know if anybody has had that question. Like, you hear all this, oh, well you struggle with executive functioning, and I’m like, you know. I dunno what that means. And I look it up and I maybe I read something and it still is [00:05:30] like over my head or it doesn’t Mm-Hmm.

[00:05:32] So I asked Amy that. Mm-Hmm. And anybody else have that question? You can just plop it in the chat. But Amy, could you tell me what you told me? Could you tell them what 

[00:05:42] Amy Bryant: you told me? Well, I wish I had like memory recall and could tell you exactly what I said, but, so executive functioning is usually a part of this A DHD diagnosis.

[00:05:54] So if it’s okay with you, I’m gonna backtrack just a tiny bit [00:06:00] because I think there’s a part of this neurodiversity that’s going to be really important for creatives to know because they might not know that they are neurodiverse and they might have a lot to unpack. And then they’re definitely gonna, well, I shouldn’t say definitely there’s gonna be things that they’re gonna be like light bulb, like, oh, okay.

[00:06:20] And so some of these things we’ve talked about that’s totally related to executive functions, which has nothing to do about whether or not you can be a CEO or run a business. [00:06:30] Um, A DHD people are brilliant at running businesses ’cause we like to do a hundred things at once and we like to cu tons of information and put it into this space, right?

[00:06:42] That’s how our brains work. Um, so like neurodiversity in general is just how people all over the world think, act, behave, communicate how they visualize and process information that’s [00:07:00] neurodiversity and we need it, right? We need different kinds of thinkers and actors like behaviors and visualizing and all those things.

[00:07:08] That’s what makes. iPhones and beautiful paintings and amazing music and creative design, and it gets us to the moon and right. But neurodivergence means that the world says this is all the things we should be able to do, but we diverge from that and we do things this way. And then of [00:07:30] course, we typically get labeled with, you’re lazy.

[00:07:33] You’re a slacker. You’re bad, you’re dumb, you’re unmotivated. You are not trying, you’re not working hard enough. You are a procrastinator, you are a dreamer. And so we get those labels and we tend to hold it and apply it to ourselves instead of going like, no, you just actually don’t understand how my brain works.

[00:07:57] Yes, yes. Shame labels. [00:08:00] 100% Shamess. Mm-Hmm. And so then instead of going, well, who am I? Where do my strengths, we go, well, I have to try harder. I have to do more. I, if I just really try, I can make this happen. Instead, we really have to back ’em and be like, who are we? So instead of pathologizing behaviors, which is what unfortunately my field does and schools do, and adults in general for children, do what we need to be [00:08:30] doing is going, what are their strengths?

[00:08:32] And let’s put those strengths forward. What are their interests? Let’s put their interests forward. No matter if you’re 12 or 25 or 50 or 70, right? Whenever that is. Um, that if instead, what can we do to put there? What supports do we need to minimize what’s super hard and maximize what we’re really good at?

[00:08:58] Right? And so then when we go [00:09:00] into the context of, of executive functioning, what executive functioning skills are you good at? Which ones are difficult for you? Where do you need support? And so, um, I, because I’m a DHD, I have to have cheat sheets, right? Because when I’m super excited or passionate or talking in front of people, I’m gonna get so excited.

[00:09:22] I’ll go off on a tangent. And so I have to be like, oh, right here’s the executive functions. So that’s one of the ways I support myself. Um, [00:09:30] I also have like silly putty, or this is thinking putty here for when I need to like get back regulated sensory stuff helps. Diane stands a lot. That’s how she keeps her body focused and doing things.

[00:09:45] Sometimes I have to get up and.

[00:09:50] So executive functionings organization, can you get things organized? But then also can you keep them organized and can you find things [00:10:00] so I can get things super organized, but I cannot tell you what I did and then maintain that it all falls apart. 

[00:10:08] diane: So, so I’m just gonna, so for me, I, I’m pretty messy I guess, but I’m very organized in some ways that, so much so that at the end of my sister’s freshman year, I had like organized her drawer in her desk.

[00:10:24] She said, where’s my address book? And I knew exactly where I had put it nine [00:10:30] months later when she was at the end of spring semester and she was trying to get her friend’s addresses before she came home for. And so I was like, it’s in the back left corner. You’ve probably put something over it. But I could remember those things.

[00:10:43] So I feel like I am organized, but my brain is not. So yes, everything’s kind of out of place, so I really need to know where things are and I really do. Mm-Hmm. Use, I don’t know if anybody else is like that as cur as a creative, like I really. Lean into my [00:11:00] memory a lot. I think that you and I are different in this way, Amy, maybe.

[00:11:03] Amy Bryant: Mm-Hmm. Um, well, so I’m the same if I always know where things are ’cause I put ’em back in the same place. So like the refrigerator’s a great example. I have to put the yogurt in the same place or it’s gonna get pushed to the back and go bad. ’cause I’m gonna forget it’s there because there’s too much stuff in our refrigerator and there’s so many people I have to like put my bag on the hook or I’m gonna lose it.

[00:11:25] ’cause I don’t know where I put it. But like, I’m also the finder of the [00:11:30] family. Um, and so that means like, Hey mom, do you know where the yes sits? ’cause I see it and I remember, but if I’m working on something and then I’m like, oh yeah, let me write that down. Oh crap, what was I doing? Mm-Hmm. Or I walk out of the room to get something and I go, oh, what did I come in here for?

[00:11:48] Right. But that’s another piece. So that is working memory. So your working memory is also an executive functioning. What did I come into the room for? Um, can I [00:12:00] store information and access it when I need it? So I know all this stuff, but I can’t always access it when I need it. Now, if I’m riffing with you on Marco Polo, I probably can pull them up.

[00:12:16] For the most part, flexible thinking is another one. When something changes unexpectedly, can I go with it? Hmm. I’m pretty good with flexible thinking. If the dog vomits at the floor and I was supposed [00:12:30] to leave at 10 and I can’t leave at noon, and then I get there late, like I might get a little frustrated, but like, okay.

[00:12:37] That’s fine. Yeah. 

[00:12:38] diane: I think as creatives or if we’re owning our own business, you own your own business. Being able to be flexible. If you’re a designer, illustrator, client, you don’t have control of everything, so. Mm-Hmm. You have to be flexible. That flexible brain, I think. But that’s a good maybe interview question.

[00:12:54] Mm-Hmm. Because if, if that’s gonna be like a, something that’s gonna shut down and you’re [00:13:00] in a place where you really have to keep that together. Mm-Hmm. That might not be a good, you know, maybe again, it’s looking at your strengths, like, oh, we’re not, we’re gonna hire you ’cause we love you, but we’re gonna put you in somewhere in, we’re not gonna have to deal with that if you’re, if you don’t flex.

[00:13:15] Well, well, but 

[00:13:16] Amy Bryant: also if you struggle with flexible thinking, awareness is everything. So, okay. Flexible thinking’s, it’s not really, but if it were flexible, thinking’s hard for me, so I’m gonna pat in extra time, or [00:13:30] I’m gonna remind myself, this may or may not work out, or I’m gonna tell a friend, Hey. This might not work out and I might have big feelings and I might need to text you and rant and rave in order to get to a place of flexible thinking like, oh, this is gonna be okay.

[00:13:47] Right. And so there’s ways we can put supports in there. If it’s something that’s difficult for us, it doesn’t mean we can’t do it. It means we need supports to get through it. 

[00:13:58] diane: So I guess like with executive function [00:14:00] with neurodiversity, this wasn’t a, these weren’t terms that I was familiar with until Mm-Hmm.

[00:14:06] More recently. Mm-Hmm. And I think that it’s, I know you and I have had conversations on this and me and other people have had conversations on this too. Yeah. Where it feels like we’ve been, like, you know, when we were in school, you just had to do it this way, you know? Yeah. You had to behave like the other people.

[00:14:24] Mm-hmm. To just be able to function. Mm-Hmm. And, and it’s a little different now and there are 

[00:14:29] things [00:14:30] 

[00:14:30] Amy Bryant: that, oh no, schools are the same schools. You still. The schools haven’t changed in 150 years, so, 

[00:14:37] diane: so yeah. Okay. So, um, maybe some of the students have changed and what their needs are. Like, I didn’t even know there was such a thing as school refusal.

[00:14:51] Mm-Hmm. Um, but I don’t have kids, so, you know, but I didn’t know somebody could, I mean, to be honest, I was happy to go to school, you know, like that’s [00:15:00] where my friends were. And I could be a little bit wilder, I guess, than I was at, um, home, pretty, pretty straight laced there at the Gibbs house. You know, I would be like, y’all be quiet.

[00:15:10] Y’all be quiet. I’m gonna get in trouble. Right? Sh Amy. Yeah. Yeah. Amy had a, a big, big voice. I’d rather go to Amy’s house than her come to my house. Um, yeah. But, but so school was a release for me being able to go to school was a release. Mm-Hmm. And I could function, [00:15:30] um. Better than maybe other people.

[00:15:33] Mm-Hmm. It wasn’t, didn’t mean I was an a student, it just meant that I could fly under the radar 

[00:15:39] Amy Bryant: more. Yes. Yes. So, but now you had the ability to Yeah, I had the 

[00:15:44] diane: ability, but now I think that there are other things. I don’t think it’s like, oh, well Judy doesn’t wanna go to school. I’m not gonna go to school either.

[00:15:52] I don’t think there’s that, like the people that I know about school refusal, it’s, it’s a different thing. So, and I, yeah. The reason why [00:16:00] I’m, we’re not talking about kids. We’re not whatever. Yeah. But, but it’s like, okay, there are things that I didn’t even know existed. Mm-Hmm mm-Hmm. That are now, these are gonna be the people that we’re hiring.

[00:16:10] These are gonna be Yeah. How people, we have to, we have to adjust how we’re thinking that it’s not exactly the same as what it was. Mm-Hmm. When, when we were in school. Um, yeah. This month is focused, we focused January, we. Me and the people here. Mm-Hmm mm-Hmm. Uh, and I focus the [00:16:30] podcast, the show, whatever, the YouTube channel during January on mental health, because I feel like it’s gray and cold 

[00:16:39] Amy Bryant: and, Mm-Hmm.

[00:16:40] diane: I don’t know. It’s harder after the holidays or whatever, so. Mm-Hmm. I wanted, I want people to understand that, asking for help. I mean, obviously we need to ask for help if, if we’re having issues. If you don’t know how to do something, ask for help. You know, try to figure it out a little bit, but then ask for help.

[00:16:57] But why do so many people [00:17:00] do you, and maybe creatives are, um, a specific category here, but, um, why do you think people have a hard time, maybe at this time of year, but why do you think people have a hard time asking for help for their mental 

[00:17:13] Amy Bryant: health? Oh, I mean, unfortunately it’s still very stigmatized, right?

[00:17:20] Well, um, I mean, we’re given, we’re given, um. Messaging at very early ages that we should just be able to [00:17:30] do it and we’re supposed to be independent. And again, all those, all those messages, shaming messages of why can’t you just do this? Why can’t you just work harder? Why can’t you just try harder? Um, why can’t you make yourself?

[00:17:46] And so we’re, we’re not building, we’re not building from our schools. A culture of reaching out for help. We’re building a culture of shame. Schools are much more strict than they ever were before. Kids get in much bigger [00:18:00] trouble than they did when we were younger for small infractions. Um, well, Mara said 

[00:18:06] diane: she was like, uh, she was called motor mouth, and that was again, shaming.

[00:18:10] And so then that made her be quiet. So then we wouldn’t ask, we aren’t going to, 

[00:18:16] Amy Bryant: um, no, absolutely. 

[00:18:18] diane: And so we’ve been told that this is something to. Our energy or Mm-Hmm. Our weird brains. How we think it’s something that we’re, we’re not, um, able to [00:18:30] explore as a superpower. 

[00:18:32] Amy Bryant: Sure. We’re, we’ve been told that it’s something that’s bad, that we need to fix and change instead of, look how powerful this brain is.

[00:18:40] Look at at what all it can do. Let’s figure out what’s hard so we can figure out how to support it. Right. Instead, we’re, we’re like, we have to be more organized. Just be more disciplined. That’s not actually what’s gonna help, because it’s not about, it’s not about wanting, it’s literally [00:19:00] about ability. And in a world who says, you have to do this, it becomes a disability because you’re shamed for not being able to do it.

[00:19:09] Whereas otherwise it’s just, yeah. My brain doesn’t do that. 

[00:19:13] diane: So in for what are some things that we could do if we were, if you. When would you tell somebody to reach out for help? Like if they’re a entrepreneur and they’re feeling maybe [00:19:30] overwhelmed and they’re like, I just need to soldier on. I just need to push through.

[00:19:34] Like Mm-Hmm. When is it the right time? Like, I don’t know if that’s even, I feel like a lot of people just don’t ask for help. They’re like, oh, it needs to be a worse problem. But actually, if you ask for help when it’s, it isn’t blown outta proportion and you can still, you know, do things, then maybe that’s when, 

[00:19:55] Amy Bryant: yeah.

[00:19:55] I, I think, um, I think it’s really hard for [00:20:00] us to reach out for help. I mean, I am, I, I’m a therapist in therapy. I think therapy is the most brilliant thing ever. Um, and of course finding the right therapist or the right executive functioning coach, or I. Whomever. Just, just recognizing that you, you wake up and you’re like, crap, what is today gonna bring?

[00:20:27] Or going? I kind of wish I could fall asleep [00:20:30] and not wake up for weeks. Or I wish I could go on vacation for five or six months, or I really wish I could escape this. I really wish I wasn’t feeling overwhelmed every day. I wish every day wasn’t a struggle or every day in five days was a struggle. I wish I didn’t feel like I was crawling outta my skin.

[00:20:55] I wish I didn’t feel inept and capable [00:21:00] like I’m a bad person. I wish I didn’t feel like I can’t get a handle on things. I wish I didn’t feel like I was a hot mess. Yeah. But 

[00:21:08] diane: like how do you, do you type that into the, the Google and or like find me a counselor to help me 

[00:21:14] Amy Bryant: mess how? Find help. Yes. How do you find help raise, and I don’t really know, like I didn’t even know 

[00:21:20] diane: that there was an executive functioning coach or executive function therapist.

[00:21:24] Like 

[00:21:25] Amy Bryant: I, I think it’s tricky. I’m not gonna lie. I think a lot of people are [00:21:30] saying, get a planner and get more organized. This is dumb. This isn’t gonna fix my executive functioning things, but it will help me. I’ll tell you what, I use cards every day. I get out a card and I say, what do I have to do? And then I put notes on it to remind myself as I go.

[00:21:48] And at the end of day I look at it and I go, well, I’ll just add these to tomorrow. That’s good. Right? But it’s something, right? Look at all these people. And I also wanna, I gotta let 

[00:21:58] diane: Jack, he just keep [00:22:00] scratching. Keep going. 

[00:22:00] Amy Bryant: Keep, yes dude. Let him in him in. I also just wanna say that. Like, I don’t consider myself an expert neurodiversity.

[00:22:08] And how the brain works is something we are always learning more about. The more we learn, the more we realize we have to expand this idea of what it means. What does it mean to lean into what our strengths are? Um, so someone asked, what is the balance between leaning into your strengths, but challenging ourselves to [00:22:30] grow in areas of weaknesses?

[00:22:31] Well, there’s a difference between things that are difficult. What’s our growing edge and what is something our brain actually can’t do? Right. Okay. 

[00:22:41] diane: So, okay, so in that, what, ’cause I had never heard of that growing edge. Maybe I need to, anyway. 

[00:22:48] Amy Bryant: You’re telling lots of, I mean, okay. So I, I like to use myself.

[00:22:52] Um, my growing edge is knowing that. Oh gosh. Well, this would have to [00:23:00] be a lot of self-reflection. Um, let, let me see if I can use my working memory to pull up an example. I have plenty. Um, my growing edge would be feeling overwhelmed, knowing that when I, in that space, sometimes when lots of people are asking things from me, I can’t, I say I can’t word, right?

[00:23:20] I can’t access the language I need in that moment and in, and instead of going, everybody shut it, my [00:23:30] growing edge is to go, I need a second. I can’t find my words. Or I just say, I can’t word. I’ll be back. Right? And to know, to, to give my body and brain honor and say, this is hard for me. Nothing bad. I’m not coming to any harm.

[00:23:47] But it’s okay for me to honor my own needs in this moment and say, I’ll be back. Going to get water, doing some wall pushups, playing with some putty, petting the dog, whatever I need to [00:24:00] get my body back into a state of regulation or back into my window of tolerance is what, you know, Dr. Dan Siegel talks about, um, what do I need in that moment to honor myself so that I can move back into relationship or back into work or back into what the thing is.

[00:24:19] And I think the growing edge is knowing the difference between what is within your ability and what is just something you actually need help with. 

[00:24:28] diane: Okay. [00:24:30] So how do you test that? Like to see if it’s a, something you need help with, something that your brain doesn’t do, or because it fits. I don’t know if it’s something I can learn or if it’s something that I’m gonna have to, 

[00:24:48] Amy Bryant: so, and it’s also a quality of life issue, right?

[00:24:51] Could you do it? Let’s face it. A DHD people can do it. Bleep ton of things. Look at that. I bleeped myself. [00:25:00] Um, right. They can do so many things. It’s not that I can’t do those some things, it’s that I hate doing ’em. And like, should I always push through and do the things I hate? I don’t think so. Why, why, why do we make ourselves do things we hate?

[00:25:17] Sometimes we have to, right. I have to write case notes. I don’t always like it, but I don’t hate it. I hate cooking and washing dishes. [00:25:30] Sometimes I just do them. Yeah. Brands not meals. Yeah. So here’s some questions. So here’s some know your strengths questions. So your, what do you look forward to? Okay. What do you really look forward to?

[00:25:46] What is easy to start? Hmm. What’s really easy to just move right into doing what’s easy to accomplish or complete. So not just starting something, but what’s easy to [00:26:00] finish. You don’t have to write ’em down. I can email ’em to you. 

[00:26:05] diane: It does help me to, this is a process for me also. 

[00:26:08] Yeah. 

[00:26:09] Amy Bryant: Feel free to write it.

[00:26:09] So, so 

[00:26:10] diane: you, you also knew Gay Hen or have read Gay Hendricks? Yeah. And I got to interview him for camp and I told him, I was like, my friend 

[00:26:20] Amy Bryant: Amy would really like for you to say, 

[00:26:21] diane: Hey Amy or something, or, I don’t remember, but So if you’re, when you say that what’s easy to finish or, [00:26:30] um, I think about, he talks about like your genius zone.

[00:26:35] So to me, when I think about only living in that, it actually stresses me out. Like I get, I don’t, I don’t know. There are sometimes it’s really nice to just rake or to clean the bathroom. Yeah. Or, um, like it’s, it is a, I know that’s not my genius zone. And [00:27:00] then in a way, I guess it makes me feel bad if I’m not living in that.

[00:27:03] But it helps me to pros. It just helps. Mm-Hmm. Sometimes I do it as a, as a, I don’t wanna do that other thing. I’m gonna go 

[00:27:11] Amy Bryant: clean the bathroom. So, but that is actually how you regulate. Okay. That’s what puts your body into a state of regulation. So a DH, ADHD is this really crappy term attention deficit hyperactivity disorder.

[00:27:24] That’s actually not at all what it is. You don’t have a deficit of attention because sometimes you [00:27:30] get lost doing things you deeply love. Mm-Hmm. And so what it is, is it’s a regulatory. Difficulty. I can’t regulate my attention. So if it’s something I hate, no matter how much I want to, I can’t make myself sit down and do it.

[00:27:45] I can’t make myself read it. I can’t make myself learn it. I can’t make myself pay attention to it. I could play with petty all day and not be able to pay attention to someone doing math theory. I just can’t do it. I’m not bad at math, but [00:28:00] it’s so boring to me. But other people love it because that’s their special interest, right?

[00:28:06] It’s also not hyperactivity. It’s about not being able to regulate your energy. So sometimes I’m super excited and I’m dancing around the house, and when I was little, I would have to climb to the top of a doorframe to brush my teeth. Or if I was going someplace, I was always running. Alternately, sometimes I can’t get [00:28:30] off the couch.

[00:28:31] Because I can’t regulate my energy. I can’t regulate my attention. I also, regulating your emotions is hard. Whether you’re six or 16 or 26 or 50. That regulatory piece in our brain has a harder time when we’re a DHD. It’s not that we can’t pay attention or focus or get things done. We have a harder time regulating, which is why special interests are so [00:29:00] important for people who are A DHD.

[00:29:02] You like to draw, you like doing digital, creative things you like. I like learning about the brain. Um, there’s things I could read about and talk about and learn about all day long. That’s not true. ’cause then I also wanna go for a paddleboard or a walk or whatever. So, 

[00:29:21] diane: so in this, to me, I’m hearing, okay, maybe there’s some language that we need.

[00:29:27] So, Mm-Hmm. We’re searching, we’re going [00:29:30] to watching things like this 

[00:29:31] Amy Bryant: or listening. So to find people Is that how we’re heading back to Yeah. And 

[00:29:34] diane: how to like, find the, the words to be able Yeah. I feel like, okay, this is a, a analogy for designers, I guess, or for Mm-Hmm. People who use Photoshop. Mm-Hmm. Or you’re in web and Mm-Hmm.

[00:29:47] I didn’t know. I don’t know what all those are called until you teach me. It’s called this. I don’t know. So I don’t know what to search for. Yeah. This is my biggest problem. So, [00:30:00] 

[00:30:00] Amy Bryant: yeah. So Psychology Today has a great search engine. Um, and you can find someone in your area. You can search by zip code. Um. And I would look for like someone who can help with a DHD.

[00:30:16] I am personally not a fan of cognitive behavioral therapy because the problem is not with will and behavior. The problem is with ability. What you wanna find, as someone who thank [00:30:30] you for putting that in there, the problem is finding out where your strengths are and what’s difficult. So the other thing to think about is here’s some what’s difficult for you.

[00:30:43] Questions. Okay? Right. So what do you find really hard to start taxes, right? Mm-Hmm. Like, oh my gosh, how hard is it to do that? Um, what do you hate doing? What do you just, Ugh, I just [00:31:00] can’t, just the thought of it makes me angry or makes me wanna take a nap or wants me, makes me wanna go outside and rake.

[00:31:10] Whatever do I put off doing? Maybe even like a procrastinate. Yeah. What do put off doing? Yeah. What do you dread? What do you procrastinate on? Um, what do you find yourself starting and stopping that feels really effortful, even if it’s in your skillset, right? Taxes, [00:31:30] billing, laundry, cooking, case notes, um, and then, and, and keeping that there, right?

[00:31:37] So when you’re exploring these things and you notice what’s difficult, then you go, okay, this, this is not because I don’t wanna be able to do these things, it’s just how my brain works. Brain works. So how do I support myself, um, when I am trying to get something done? I hate, I put my computer on my lap and I sit in front of a [00:32:00] TV on something that’s somewhat interesting, but not like.

[00:32:06] I like the walking Dead, so nothing like the walking dead where I just get lost in it and end up laying down on the couch and watching it. Um, so that then I can like start typing. And before I know it, my attention has gone from the TV to my computer and I’m immersed in it. And my husband luckily will come by and pause, and pause the TV for me ’cause he knows that’s how my brain works, right?

[00:32:29] [00:32:30] Um, or I just rewind later. Um, I, if I need to concentrate or get regulated to talk, I get some sort of sensory input. Or if I know I have to do something or if, you know you have to do something, Diane going outside and raking gets you into your window of tolerance so that then you can go in and engage on it.

[00:32:51] But you should set it up. You get everything ready to get to work before you go outside and do the thing that you wanna [00:33:00] do to avoid the work. So procrastination’s not really a thing, and motivation’s not really a thing. All that means is you’re dysregulated that you’re not in your window of tolerance, which means you can’t concentrate, which means you can’t engage, you can’t be your best self, you can’t be in attached to your thinking part of your brain.

[00:33:20] diane: Okay, so that makes a ton of sense. So then I have these answers to these questions. Mm-Hmm. Then what do I do with those to find out if I need help or if I could [00:33:30] just read a book or, Mm-Hmm. Like what level of help? Like psychology today. If I go to Psychology Today and I type in, I look forward to, I don’t, 

[00:33:42] Amy Bryant: this is what I mean.

[00:33:43] Like, so it has a search engine, so you’re gonna click on things like a DHD, or, you know, there’s so many different types of, neurodivergence says Tourettes, OCD. Um, autism lots and lots of different types of NeuroD divergences. [00:34:00] Um, and then you’re gonna look on people’s website to see are they neurodivergent affirming and inclusive.

[00:34:09] That would be my my number one thing. The last thing you want is someone who goes, I help you develop a checklist and then send you on your way. 

[00:34:17] diane: Okay, so, so I wanna um, go back to a couple things that have been in the chat. So, Dee said something about, yeah, her two kids, she, she was neuro is neuro. And then she had to watch [00:34:30] her kids who were also that way, just think differently.

[00:34:33] Have to go through the same thing. Very painful. And then Maura was talking about how, um, she was called motor mouth. I was too Maura, so I’m with you. Me too. So then, but then her daughter. So as a parent or as somebody, maybe you’re asking somebody in your business or somebody who works with you to do something and she said her daughter was caught up for not wanting to change stations.

[00:34:57] Yeah. I can see this, right? Like, um, [00:35:00] yeah. You know, I have a rhythm, I have a, we’re gonna change everything at the office. Yeah. We’re gonna start doing this this other way. And it’s like, ugh, this really could be this 

[00:35:09] Amy Bryant: regulating. Well, absolutely correct, yes. Moving from one task to another because they’re so immersed and engaged, they can’t regulate their brain to pull back from that task and start a new one.

[00:35:21] It’s so hard to get engaged that by the time you do, you look up and you’re like, I, I already have to change. I’m [00:35:30] immersed in it. I don’t want to, I’m, this is what I want to be doing. And that’s why those stations just don’t work for some kids when what they should be able to do is go, I’m gonna study this all day, or until they’re done with it.

[00:35:44] Right. Um, and finding schools that respect a child’s, um, brain is really hard. And it’s hard for college students and it’s hard for students who decide not to go to college and go learn to do something [00:36:00] else in some different way. Um, family’s neuro divergent. 

[00:36:04] diane: Yeah. And it could also be hard when, if you’re at work and you’re, um.

[00:36:09] Somebody above you is trying to get you to do something different. Um Yep. You, it’s not that you’re not willing to try, you are. But then it’s being able to say, you know, I work better like this. Or being able to have the words, yes. To be able to say that and stand 

[00:36:22] Amy Bryant: up self-advocacy, self-advocacy is so important.

[00:36:26] Like, I know you want me to do it this way, [00:36:30] I will have an easier time doing it this way. And also, you know, I think it’s so important to remember that you guys are adults. You are your own authority. Even if you have a boss, they hired you to do a job and your job is to do the job, not to do the job their way.

[00:36:48] And that can be the tricky space and a super uncomfortable conversation. But also you’re as much an authority as they are and we forget that. 

[00:36:59] diane: [00:37:00] So then. So if, if, if I’m looking for a counselor and I’m still putting in the terms that I either know or don’t know, so maybe there’s some sort of like, how would you, what if you don’t know if you’re neurodivergent or you don’t know if you like, you, like you are having trouble.

[00:37:22] Mm-Hmm. Just say like, I’m having trouble, my boss is wanting me to change stations, you know? Mm-Hmm. Switch 

[00:37:29] Amy Bryant: tasks. I [00:37:30] don’t know how to do this. Yeah. Or I’m 

[00:37:31] diane: having trouble with something that it seems like all my colleagues are, or all the, my friends that are designers are able to do this. Like my taxes or something.

[00:37:41] Right. Like, why do I have such this beat up myself on this thing? Mm-Hmm. Um, I don’t really have the words for it. So. I don’t really know. I guess I’m like, I don’t know what to search, and then I’m just stuck in this puddle that I don’t ever get out of. And then somehow in [00:38:00] January it feels even worse ’cause everybody’s setting these goals and doing all these things and yeah, then it’s just more of that kind of like, oh man, I am not like everybody else.

[00:38:09] Which one doesn’t fit in the box? 

[00:38:12] Amy Bryant: You know, like, I mean, you know, my New Year’s resolution this year was to be less efficient. I thought you said 

[00:38:19] diane: money’s 

[00:38:20] Amy Bryant: resolution. And I was like, no less efficient and less, um, less efficient. And one other words that like, [00:38:30] um, was super freeing, like, I wanna do more things that are important to me and stop trying to do everything for everybody else.

[00:38:43] And I’m not a, I mean, I, I do, I’m a therapist, I’m a helper, right? That’s what I do. Um. Yeah. So it’s really hard, right when you’re labeled difficult to work with. And that’s why it’s importantly, it, you’re gonna be the most difficult to work [00:39:00] with when you’re trying to do things that your brain wasn’t designed to do in ways that your brain wasn’t designed to do them.

[00:39:09] And so when you’re advocating for yourself, this is as important as seeing a therapist and maybe you see a therapist who can help you learn to advocate what are the language I use to advocate for myself? I wanna get to know myself and my strengths and my weaknesses. And in some ways, that’s way better than an executive functioning coach, coach.

[00:39:29] Um, [00:39:30] so then you go, look, I really wanna do this job well, and this is how my brain works. This is what I’m good at, and this is what’s hard for me. And I would love, you know, um. And figuring that out based on those, those things we talked about is gonna be really important to really explore who are you, what’s good about you, what are you really good at?

[00:39:51] And then what’s harder for you. So, and then going to your boss and saying, this is hard. 

[00:39:57] diane: So Matt has a a Yeah, [00:40:00] great comment. Just learning how to manage and operate our brains in a productive way feels like an additional full-time job while you’re doing life and a full-time job. So this is where I think people start shutting down and, um, isolating and.

[00:40:20] Absolutely. I just think it keeps getting worse and then you end up in the hospital because you’re sick, ’cause yucky stuff. I mean, it just continues, continues to get worse. So, [00:40:30] 

[00:40:30] Amy Bryant: yeah. Yeah, I mean, I think that’s the challenge. So when you’re thinking about your full-time job and thinking about, um, trying to just life, really thinking about like the, the big picture is here.

[00:40:47] How can we be kind and compassionate to ourselves instead of continuing on that shame and self-blame spiral. How can we say, you know, this, this isn’t really about me, [00:41:00] um, trying to manage my brain. It’s about me trying to embrace who I am at my core, from my brain to my toes. That was a weird statement, but you know what I mean?

[00:41:13] Like, but like 

[00:41:14] diane: I want to get things done if, sure. Sometimes we have to explore what actually is working, I think. Yes. Um, and maybe that for some people that happens a lot earlier in life. But maybe we’ve just been masking or, [00:41:30] um, I. 

[00:41:31] Amy Bryant: Yes. So much masking. We, 

[00:41:33] diane: we haven’t been, we haven’t enabled ourselves to really explore what, um, what could work.

[00:41:39] So if you were a coworker or a parent or something, it, maybe it’s giving people opportunities to try out, like what, how could we help someone to explore what does work for them? Because I think about this Yeah. And you and I have had many conversations about me trying to get students to do certain things.

[00:41:59] And since I [00:42:00] have two students, I mean two alumni in here, I’m not an easy teacher, you know? Mm-Hmm. Um, and I think it works for some people. For some people not so much, but Sure. I had a teacher who kept pushing. They were like, but you have to get this done, Diane. Mm-Hmm. And in a way, I’m really glad he pushed.

[00:42:18] Yeah. Because I was able to find. A thing that worked for me. Yeah. Yeah. And it, it was less about doing it his way, and it was just about getting it done my [00:42:30] way. Yeah. Yeah. But I can see how that could be very frustrating. But if you are ending up in the same place, it doesn’t really matter. But maybe we need to give people a little bit more grace to do it a different way, or, or if we are, they’re trying to help us do something a new way or they want us to try their way, we should at least be flexible enough to try it and then say, here’s why it doesn’t work.

[00:42:53] Mm-Hmm. What, what else? But what, how would you [00:43:00] help if somebody else wanted to do something? They were, you wanted someone to do something. Mm-Hmm. And, um, this could be a colleague or a, a somebody. Mm-Hmm. Whatever. Um, what would give 

[00:43:15] Amy Bryant: them space? I mean, so I really like, so this person says, I know how to see flow, right?

[00:43:25] I would ask like, here’s the, here’s the job. What parts of [00:43:30] this do you feel like you can do and manage well? And what, where do you need supports? I, that’s what I would say. You know, have them assess, have them be real. How do we open space up for people to do things that are within their strengths? So like the tools are always, if once you know your strengths and your challenges, where can you pull in support?

[00:43:57] What tasks can you pass off or trade with [00:44:00] someone else, whether you’re a manager or a teacher or a mom, right? If we’re managing our families, um, you know, can I hire a CPA? Right? So if you are trying to get a student or someone to do something, okay, so here’s the whole project. Which parts are you are gonna be easy for you?

[00:44:23] What parts are gonna be hard and how do we have space to say? Of course there’s gonna be parts that are hard, right? [00:44:30] Like, it’s like Matt said, everyone is trying to operate their brains and none of them come with instructions or manuals, but we can hold space to be curious and to explore. So I 

[00:44:41] diane: have um, because Oh, go ahead.

[00:44:43] Go ahead. Go ahead. No, you go. 

[00:44:45] Amy Bryant: Yeah. So, um, so regime, did I say your name correctly? Mm-Hmm. Yeah, that’s, um, says like I know how to flow in the process, but it’s difficult to delegate tasks. And so knowing that delegating [00:45:00] tasks is hard, is fantastic, right? I don’t have the solution for that. Can you delegate someone to delegate tasks?

[00:45:09] Here’s everything that needs to be done. I am terrible with delegating tasks. Um, my delegation of tasks is, honey, I can’t wash one more dish and then leaving the kitchen. That that’s the best I can do sometimes. I mean, we, we work together, but, so I 

[00:45:26] diane: had a student who, um, said, I don’t wanna take web [00:45:30] design.

[00:45:30] Well, it was part of it, and it, I could tell it was just like they were here and if I asked them to do one more thing. Yeah. And I said, well, she’d love to do cut paper. I was like, why don’t you just design your stuff on paper and then we could scan it in and that could be the backgrounds or you have the pieces like you’ve already Yeah.

[00:45:47] She’s like, I can do that. And I was like, why not? Like I think that sometimes we’re not thinking outside the box. Right. 

[00:45:54] Amy Bryant: And, and you were able to see her. Yes. And some people can’t think outside the [00:46:00] box. Right. Some people need help. Even as creatives, we still get stuck in here. Right. It has to be this way and.

[00:46:08] And then so you were able to go, well, you know, she likes cut paper. I think that’s the word you used. And so you helped her expand it. That’s exactly it. Right? So you answered your own question. Um, how do we assign things that are difficult to us, to someone else, right? How do we delegate tasks? How do we set ourselves up [00:46:30] for success?

[00:46:30] So that means knowing and accepting your limitations, right? That’s one of the ways we set ourselves up for success. Um, I turn on phone reminders. Like one of mine just reminded me to go get my kids, but you already got her right? I already, I got her earlier. Yeah. She sounds, um, she’s a teenager. She’s not really a kid, but she’s, you know, she’s my kid.

[00:46:54] Um, I have, every night it goes off to remind me to take my medications. Every morning it [00:47:00] goes off and reminds me to take my medications like. I wish I could remember. I’m set up to remember, but I don’t remember. So I, I set an alarm. I have these right next to my desk ’cause I know I’m gonna need to write something down and I just grab it and do it.

[00:47:19] diane: So is that like the remembering or the Yeah. Um, is that executive functioning 

[00:47:25] Amy Bryant: issues? Yes. It’s, it’s working memory. Yeah. Okay. That’s working memory. [00:47:30] Um, so like the working memory thing is so interesting, right? It’s, and also like, can you execute a plan that has multiple steps? So like some people can go like, oh yeah, a peanut butter sandwich, and they know what that is, but they don’t actually can’t do all the tasks to make it.

[00:47:53] This is literally an executive functioning. You have to get the bread, the peanut butter, the jelly, and then you have to open [00:48:00] everything and then you have to get the bread out and you have to. Put the peanut butter and jelly on and are you getting it on the side so that the sandwich fits together correctly?

[00:48:08] I mean, if not it, and you, you have flexible thinking it doesn’t matter. But then like what if you also want marshmallows and bananas on it, but you put the bananas on before the peanut butter and then you can’t spread the peanut butter. Right? That’s a whole executive functioning, being able to plan and execute something.

[00:48:28] And then how do you [00:48:30] put it together without the bananas and stuff falling off? And then if you forget to cut it and you take a bite, do you have enough flexible thinking to be okay with the bite being a part of the cut? Right? All of that is executive functioning. Are you impulsive? Yes.

[00:48:53] diane: So impulsivity is an executive function ’cause it’s not being able to control your 

[00:48:58] Amy Bryant: impulses in [00:49:00] inhibition. Inhibition is Yes. Yeah. 

[00:49:03] diane: Wait, inhibition? I thought inhibition was, 

[00:49:07] Amy Bryant: are you able to inhibit your impulses? Oh, 

[00:49:10] diane: I can inhibit some, but some things 

[00:49:13] Amy Bryant: I’m not Same. Sometimes I’m really good at it, sometimes I’m not.

[00:49:17] If I’m stressed out, all my executive functioning things are more exacerbated. I’m less emotionally regulated. I have poor working memory. Okay, 

[00:49:27] diane: so I’m going back to this. ’cause I feel like I, [00:49:30] I don’t have an answer to this. So I go to Psychology Today or whatever 

[00:49:33] Amy Bryant: and I, there’s not, here’s the deal, there’s not a single answer.

[00:49:36] That’s why. But I’m supposed to 

[00:49:38] diane: search and then I’m looking at what they focus on. Yeah. And if they have a ton of everything, maybe they don’t focus on 

[00:49:46] Amy Bryant: anything. You want someone who’s neurodiversity affirming and inclusive. Okay. That’s what I would be searching for. I would ask at your school, if they have a school counseling program that you could work for.

[00:49:59] I would [00:50:00] ask. Um, friends I would get on, I, I belong to a bunch of groups on Facebook with moms. I ask them, who do you like? Mm. Um, I have word of mouth is a great way, but then you also wanna talk to three people. At a minimum, you wanna call three people. You wanna get ’em on the phone. You wanna trust your deep inner knowing, like, does this pe do I feel heard, seen and valued?

[00:50:28] Or do I feel like I’m getting a sales [00:50:30] job? Or do I feel like they’re just trying to tell me what to do or they’re trying to fix me? Or are they really like, Ooh, yeah, let’s figure out what your strengths and weaknesses are. Let’s figure out what you need so that the things that are hard for you aren’t so overwhelming.

[00:50:48] You want to feel super held by this person. Like, we can do this together, and I don’t have all the answers. I don’t have all the answers even in what we’re talking [00:51:00] about. Right. But I can partner with someone and help ’em figure it out. So 

[00:51:05] diane: I feel like because so much of just growing up, or so much of it’s just there hasn’t been a solution, or I haven’t found somebody who could help me, and I don’t know if other people feel like this.

[00:51:22] It just feels like there’s nobody to help me. I just need to be okay with this. You know? Like I feel like that [00:51:30] this could be where people are and I feel like, oh, well I am. I need to just do more self-regulation or something because I feel so, at one time I was talking to my friend Raffi, and I was like, oh, I’ve gotta change all the names of these.

[00:51:47] Files and he is like, oh, Diane, there’s an easy way to do that. I was like, what? He’s like, yeah, you can do it all at once. I was like, what? Like, I didn’t know it existed. Yeah. And that’s what I feel like, [00:52:00] um, some of these things are like, 

[00:52:03] Amy Bryant: yeah, absolutely. You need, you 

[00:52:05] diane: need somebody who’s tuned in that can, that can work with you.

[00:52:11] That because it’s so, I know it seems sort of hopeless, uh, uh, what it feels like, because maybe I’ve gotten help in the past, but I haven’t really helped this thing. Right. Well, you’re 

[00:52:23] Amy Bryant: not gonna fix it. You also have to change that idea that you’re gonna fix it or that it even needs to be [00:52:30] fixing fixed.

[00:52:31] Right. How do we let go of this idea that we can do and be everything? Hmm. Even if we want to do and be everything we can’t. So what if we pick and choose the things that we fricking like. How do we prioritize doing those things that feel good, that we get deep enjoyment from? I love being a therapist.

[00:52:58] Love it. I [00:53:00] have certain clients with certain challenges that I am almost always going to make room for because they’re my passion. Like, can you dive deep into your passions and, and prioritize those and find some way to go? I can’t do it all. Who can I trade with or give this to? Or can I just, do I give this up?

[00:53:25] I used to have a huge email list and I’m like, I dread writing that [00:53:30] email every month. And I was like, I’m done with it. Right. So I think it’s like a 15,000 people on my email list. And I was like, I can’t, I can’t. It’s making me crazy. 

[00:53:43] diane: So I think that that’s really important. So the things that we’re really avoiding are the things, but we do need to talk to people about, so say it was that I like to do logos.

[00:53:53] Everybody knows I don’t like to do logos. Yeah. So I partner with somebody who’s gonna do the logo. I farm [00:54:00] that out maybe. Yeah. Instead of having to feel like I have to do every single part of Totally. The, the design thing. 

[00:54:08] Amy Bryant: Yeah. Even though you can make a logo. 

[00:54:10] diane: Absolutely. And I’ve made plenty, but it’s not, it stresses me out.

[00:54:15] So, but making a website is really fun for me. Yeah. It is. Not super fast. Um, but I like the way I work with people on making a website. Mm-Hmm. For. [00:54:30] For somebody who’s really, so say, I’m really good at this one thing, but I’m not, I don’t have words to explain it. Well. Mm-Hmm. Would you tell me to just continue, like maybe get, get some professional help in this just to be able to explain, ’cause this is like a business thing, but it’s also that you’re not living into your, the thing that you’re doing a whole bunch of other things that aren’t Mm-Hmm mm-Hmm.

[00:54:55] What you’re great at. Mm-Hmm. 

[00:54:58] Amy Bryant: What would you say? [00:55:00] Okay, so I, I’m gonna talk to you ’cause I know you, so you, you and I are verbal processors. We find the words by talking about it. Right. So for you, I would say, you call me up and you’re like, I don’t know the words for these. And I’d be like, okay, well say more about it.

[00:55:16] Right? And then together we would figure it out or you would come up with the words and then we’d write it down like crazy maniacs. And I mean that in a positive non. Psychological way. And um, [00:55:30] and, and then you would come up with your words. But for you, you have to verbally Mm-Hmm. Get to those words.

[00:55:36] ’cause that’s how your brain works. Mm-Hmm. Right? Like, I can write, I do write, I love to write, but sometimes I also have to talk, right? Like we Marco Pillow all the time, and I come up with things and I go, right, but, oh yeah, that is what I believe where I go, oh yeah, I don’t believe that. Right? Mm-Hmm. But that’s just how your brain works.

[00:55:55] So, like Matt says, I can run a business for 25 years and work with [00:56:00] multiple clients on complicated projects with a variety of deadlines and making custom artwork. And yet sandwiches seem really more difficult at times because that’s just how your brain works. Right? And so then you know that, that whatever that executive functioning skill is that my working memory won’t give to me right now, um, is difficult for your brain.

[00:56:25] And so then what you could do, Matt, if you don’t mind [00:56:30] me saying, is you could take pictures of the steps and you just put those pictures right on the refrigerator so that you can take ’em down and use it so that you don’t have to overtax your brain. Right. You could even probably Google how to make a sandwich, and it would put the steps up there for you so that you don’t always have to be making yourself exhausted by having to overthink everything.

[00:56:56] diane: Hmm. I think that, I think there’s so many things for [00:57:00] me that have been, um, like, oh yes, she’s a great illustrator. Yeah, you can totally 

[00:57:06] Amy Bryant: illustrate them. That would be amazing. So when 

[00:57:09] diane: you’re. When there are things that I know, I know the word for, that I’ve spoken about or I’ve been able to listen to and now I have this word, now I can go and find somebody who could help me with this.

[00:57:22] Sure. Yeah. Yeah. And it maybe it’s just helping to accept that I have this and then come up with some, like you have alarms to [00:57:30] help you with memory for time blindness. Maybe I need something like a cube that doesn’t let me go too long in a whatever. Yeah. But I need to see what works and maybe somebody else will be like my friend Raffi and be like, you don’t have to do each one of those individually.

[00:57:46] Yes, you can do them all. Someone else will have a solution. But I need, but I, instead of just saying, this is how I am, I’m accepting and I’m not gonna say it out loud. Mm-Hmm. I’m need to find somebody who can maybe help me with [00:58:00] different, um, different tasks. And it may not be the same therapist. For each different thing also.

[00:58:07] Mm-Hmm. I think that that’s one thing. A old brain kind of, or a yes that have the same therapist for 25 years. I’m not sure that that’s, 

[00:58:17] Amy Bryant: it might not even be a therapist. I mean, honestly, your therapist is gonna help you unpack all that shame crap that we’re holding onto all those labels. That I’m lazy or stupid or I’m a slacker.

[00:58:29] Slacker is [00:58:30] my big one. Oh, I’m such a slacker. I can tell you I’m not a slacker, but that word lives in my brain and body, right? That I’m a slacker. It’s just not the truth. I 

[00:58:41] diane: would never think of you like that, 

[00:58:42] Amy Bryant: but, or lazy. You like none of those, right? But they live in us. And how do we, you know, the, the science says that the body keeps the score that our body holds onto these old wounds and these old things, these old messages.

[00:58:57] And how do we move it out of our brain and body? How [00:59:00] do we let ’em go and be like, screw that. That is so not true. You know, I’m gonna live my passionate, amazing life. I 

[00:59:09] diane: think as an entrepreneur, when I hear that, it feels a little wooy, woo, wooo, whatever. It’s like, ah, but Amy, I can’t make 

[00:59:19] Amy Bryant: money about that.

[00:59:19] The body keeps the score. 

[00:59:20] diane: No. Wait, what part? No, no. The, I’m gonna live my, whatever you said. Like my full life. And I Sure. Right. So, ’cause she’s somebody [00:59:30] who I’ve loved for many, many, many years. She knows I can be 

[00:59:34] Amy Bryant: myself. 

[00:59:34] diane: Say that like, yeah. Uh, Amy, but I can’t make a living like that. Yeah. Right. And I know that some of those are limiting beliefs, but I also feel like I 

[00:59:43] Amy Bryant: don’t Yeah.

[00:59:44] If I, no, but Absolutely. Right. Those things have to get done. They don’t have to get done by you. Ah. 

[00:59:55] diane: She’s looking at me like, I you need to take this in long-term memory there, [01:00:00] Diane. No, I get it. 

[01:00:02] Amy Bryant: I mean, I say this, I do my own Instagram. I’m not good at it, but I like it, which is why I do it. Right, right.

[01:00:12] Because it’s fun to be creative. Be, oh, Diane Therapy is in session. 

[01:00:17] diane: Yes, it’s, but it, but that’s good. Like, I think, but it’s, it’s also those things that are really triggering that. Um, and Megan is my mini me. Um, she says, [01:00:30] I feel like I’m like, Diane, like, suture someone else suture. Sure someone else can do it, but they won’t.

[01:00:39] So it’s.

[01:00:45] And it just feels Yeah. Like a little too, it feels like a lot for, for me. Yeah. Where does something feel like it’s too much and I’m like, yeah, nobody else is gonna do it. I’m gonna have to do it. 

[01:00:58] Amy Bryant: Um, yeah, that’s one. And it’s, delegating is [01:01:00] hard. 

[01:01:00] diane: Delegate, right. Because I don’t wanna Yeah. Impose on somebody and they don’t wanna do it.

[01:01:06] It really needs to be done. It’s important. I don’t wanna do it, but I do it. And I know Megan does that too, but like, if you’re, if you are in, I’m, I’m trying to think about this like with like, I would love to make money with things that I was illustrating, that I was licensing. Not somebody saying, Hey, can you draw this robot?

[01:01:29] [01:01:30] No, I really don’t wanna draw your robots. I wanna draw my robots, you know? Mm-Hmm mm-Hmm. But, but there’s another piece. I have to go out. I have to create the. You know, collections. Mm-Hmm. And then I have to go out and sell it to someone. Yes. You know? And then why is it so much easier for me to sell a website than it is ’cause it has to do with value, or it’s me putting myself on the line.

[01:01:52] So maybe those are things I could get help with Mm-Hmm. In dealing with. And then maybe that is something that I delegate. Hey, get an art [01:02:00] agent and that art agent’s gonna spell the work or Yes, exactly. But sometimes I don’t know that there are those things like Raffi was like, you don’t have to rename every single one.

[01:02:10] Right? Yes. But I need to talk to people because maybe it’s a really fast, quick thing. But I also think what I tend to do, and Amy knows this, is I’ll just take it on. Mm-Hmm. It’s just what it is. And I just move forward until I can’t anymore. Mm-Hmm. [01:02:30] Right. To 

[01:02:31] Amy Bryant: sure. And you get burnout. Yeah. And burnout is a real thing.

[01:02:36] Um, and coming off of the holiday of, you know, November, December, new Year’s, all this pressure to change up our lives and be better. I don’t know, maybe sometimes we need to stop striving to be better and we need to go. I’m alright. 

[01:02:56] diane: Right? I’m alright, 

[01:02:58] Amy Bryant: I’m alright. [01:03:00] You know? Yeah. This growth mindset, I don’t know, can be kind of exhausting.

[01:03:06] That’s true. Right? What if we go, what if we assume we’re gonna grow without striving for it? 

[01:03:15] diane: Well, I think for me, growth mindset is that I’m not stuck in this one thing. Sure. I, it’s, yeah. I think fixed mindset and growth mindset fixed is like, I was born this way, I am this [01:03:30] way, this is who I am. Growth is, I can change.

[01:03:34] You know, there is a possibility I’m not gonna be stuck like this’s for the rest of my 

[01:03:38] Amy Bryant: life. I think there’s something in between. I think there’s acceptance of who we are and how our brain works, and then going, uh, sometimes I’m kind of a jerk when or, um, you know, but I don’t know if it always means doing things harder.

[01:03:57] diane: Yeah. I, I mean, I hope it doesn’t, but that’s what, [01:04:00] there’s so much of my life, it’s just been, oh, this is just another hard thing Diane has to do, and I just have to Yeah. Just have to do it and, and I to get through it. Do that. I just Sure. Push on and I’m, I do too. Yeah. Right. But if I think about, so I like these, what do I look forward to?

[01:04:17] What’s easy to start instead of like limiting, like I can’t make money doing blank. You know, like, yeah, maybe you can, maybe there’s, you can a roughy solution that makes the thing Yeah. You know, the things that, I can’t [01:04:30] imagine it being that he’s like, oh, you, you know, but I just needed, yeah. I needed to, um, tell him something that I was trying to do that was frustrating and he was like, you don’t have to do that.

[01:04:43] So it was me being vulnerable to someone. Yeah. So again, maybe trying out some of these different people who could help me with time blindness or help me with some things that could possibly help. I do, I do realize that another thing is the [01:05:00] things that annoy me, that people are asking or Yeah. You know, like, why is that a trigger for me?

[01:05:06] You know? Like, because you’re 

[01:05:08] Amy Bryant: taxed. Yeah. Because you’re taxed. That’s why. Sometimes it’s a trigger ’cause it’s an old thing. But usually it’s because we’re just taxed and we can’t do anything else. Well, and sometimes it just 

[01:05:20] diane: feels fake. Like if somebody’s asking something and they’re trying to be authentic and really help me, but they’re using the same words, the [01:05:30] same questions that you know 30 other people.

[01:05:33] And I’m like, man, if you ask me that question, I’m gonna lose my bonkers, you know, my bonkers, my marbles, I’m gonna lose something because I can’t take anybody asking me this again. It feels in, yes, it feels inauthentic. Insincere. It feels insincere. It feels like you’re just, I don’t know. I just don’t. And I feel like that’s where.

[01:05:55] I don’t know. I think things are Yeah. Gonna be changing. Yeah. I can’t find five [01:06:00] bons. I lost my bonkers. Okay. Amy, I’m trying to think about the, uh, all the things we talked about. A DHD. We talked about executive functions. We didn’t talk about time blindness, but maybe next time we can have you. 

[01:06:11] Amy Bryant: Time blindness is a, is a piece of that.

[01:06:13] Right? It’s it’s a part. If you have time blindness, you’re not gonna fix it or change it. No, it’s not. It’s never gonna change. You have to plan for it to show up. Mm. I had it yesterday. You’re not gonna grow outta it. [01:06:30] Yeah. And when you’re more stressed out, your time blindness is, blindness is gonna be greater.

[01:06:36] Mm. All the things you struggle with are gonna be more exacerbated when you’re overwhelmed or stressed out or under a time constraints. Mm-Hmm. I couldn’t think of the word. That’s okay. Um. So I, I 

[01:06:52] diane: wanna share ways that people could, um, uh, and, uh, another, Matt says depression is a [01:07:00] big one, especially for those who work alone at home.

[01:07:02] So again, just like time blindness, Matt, you need to, I think if it were me, because if I’m working at home alone, I need people. So I need people. Yep. And so I have to get out of the house. I have to make sure that I have time scheduled in with people where I have real conversations. Mm-Hmm. So I know Chris Martin, I have a conversation with him once a month and Paul and I meet on a Saturday.

[01:07:29] I mean, [01:07:30] nine real life, but maybe one day Paul. Um, and then Megan and I are gonna get, you know, it’s like I schedule in time with people who are really gonna be able to see me and know me. Um, or I can share something and be seen. And sometimes it’s about seeing them. It’s not always about me too, but I do think if.

[01:07:51] If depression is for me, if depression is connected to being alone and isolated mm-Hmm. Then I need to make sure I’m doing things [01:08:00] every week. For me, it’s a every week thing that are, and maybe it’s every day I connect with somebody in a genuine way. Um, but that’s important for me. Yeah. And if you have just life being 

[01:08:12] Amy Bryant: happy.

[01:08:12] Yeah. Well, and every human needs some kind of connection, but if executive functioning is difficult, having the same thing every week is helpful so that you don’t always have to plan ’cause you can get frozen in trying to make the plans and trying to make it happen. Speaking of time, [01:08:30] blindness, what time are we, we gotta 

[01:08:30] diane: go get done.

[01:08:31] Yeah. Now. So I wanna share all your links. 

[01:08:35] Amy Bryant: Great. Sure, no problem. You’re, you’re better at the time than me. Well, you’re sharing the links. Um, I, I would say so. Matt, Matt said something that I just wanna read. He said Growth is good, but stopping and just being cool with and being content and all the growth I’ve already done is good too.

[01:08:56] And I think that’s so important. Um, [01:09:00] my, what I hope that y’all would take away is this invitation to see things that are hard for you and ways that maybe feel, have labeled failure or lazy or whatever shammy, crappy words they’ve used. Difficult. Um, difficult. Yeah. Are you difficult to work with? I mean, you’re probably not, you’re probably just not being obedient.

[01:09:27] Yay. Oh, sorry. That’s my wild child. [01:09:30] Um, but like, really to turn towards yourself with kindness and compassion. ’cause that’s where it starts and. Reminding yourself like, I’m not lazy, I’m not difficult. I deserve to bring my gifts to the world, and, and I have gifts to bring to the world, and I don’t have to bring them in a way that the world says I have to.

[01:09:55] I don’t have to jump through the world hoops to bring my gifts and passions [01:10:00] into the world. Um, I don’t know. The world’s expectations are kind of ridiculous. Yeah. Like we have to shower every day, brush our teeth twice a day, look nice, do all the work, do all the things, cook dinner, eat man. I have to keep the toothbrush in my car.

[01:10:21] Hmm. Because I’ll just forget otherwise. 

[01:10:24] diane: All right. Well, I wanna read your, um, ways for people to get in touch with you. So [01:10:30] Wild child counseling.com. Yeah. Um, Instagram at Wild Child a l That’s right. Mm-Hmm. I can’t see your face, so, um, oh yeah, I’m, uh, listening to you saying yes or no at on Facebook, facebook.com/wild Child Counseling.

[01:10:50] And then if you wanna email her directly, it’s Amy a m y@wildchildcounseling.com. And that’s it. I [01:11:00] super appreciate you coming on and sharing and asking hard questions and answering questions over and over and over for me. 

[01:11:10] Amy Bryant: Oh, thanks for inviting me and thanks everybody for showing up. This is a topic I love and talking with one of my favorite people who I also love.

[01:11:20] I love you too. I didn’t even get to share any good stories about you, man. 

[01:11:26] diane: Well, do you have a quick one? Y’all can leave now [01:11:30] then. We have lots of stories. We, I mean, from age 13. We used to do this across, we were across the way in English, 

[01:11:42] Amy Bryant: the first class we had together. ’cause she wouldn’t let us sit next to each other because we’d get in 

[01:11:46] diane: trouble for talking.

[01:11:46] So then we would do this. I would not say anything, but it sort of looks like I love you. And then I said vacuum, [01:12:00] but it sort of looked like I said something else.

[01:12:07] Amy Bryant: Yeah. So yeah, and then we pretend to look at other people, or maybe I just did this and I would say elephant shoes and vacuum to them, depending on how I felt about them. 

[01:12:17] diane: We passed notes, but this was like, she literally had a sea, it was like, you know, 

[01:12:23] Amy Bryant: oh yeah. There was the rail between 

[01:12:25] diane: like, we couldn’t have passed note, like she was on the other side.

[01:12:29] We’d each other. [01:12:30] Yeah. It was too far. So, um, but with lots of, we had high school from eighth grade to 12th grade. That was when our high school, our undergrad, our under our elementary school was kindergarten through seventh grade. Yeah. So it was, um, a lot of time. But we had, um, it was, and, 

[01:12:52] Amy Bryant: and then we sort of lost touch a little in college, but then we kept coming back.

[01:12:58] Yeah. [01:13:00] On and off. It was awesome. It was, remember when we wouldn’t see each other for a long time and then for like, I don’t know, six months or a year and we’d come back together and we’d sort of have changed in these similar ways. That’s so great. Yeah. 

[01:13:15] diane: And we still see that. We still do that. We’re still changing.

[01:13:19] Amy Bryant: Yeah. Fricking 50 man. 

[01:13:21] diane: Yeah. Hey, and your birthday’s coming up, but it’s not today. Today’s 

[01:13:25] Amy Bryant: sugar’s birthday. Oh, sugar. Can’t spell sugar without. [01:13:30] 

[01:13:30] diane: Ut a ut a. That’s right. And I went to Auburn. We’re eagle. Um, anyway. Thank you guys. Next week I have, uh, Natalie Callbox. She’s been on before, but this one, uh, Instagram is wild child a TL.

[01:13:45] Correct? Yes. Um, and, uh, Natalie is gonna be talking about a sabbatical. We think that a sabbatical is really the, a solution. I just need to take a break. Sometimes. So I called it the [01:14:00] truth about sabba a sabbatical because maybe we are putting too much. Hmm. Maybe we shouldn’t put everything into the sabbatical.

[01:14:09] ’cause then, then it’s just can be anyway. Don’t wanna it. She learned a lot and she did a lot of different things that really helped her. So I can’t wait for y’all to hear what she’s done. And, and she’s an artist. Artist, you know. I mean, she’s definitely an entrepreneur and she’s had a business, but she’s been like a Strathmore artist.

[01:14:29] When you buy the [01:14:30] paper, the Strathmore paper, whatever, she’s had her art on that. And she sells stamps and books. She’s written books, north light books and all kinds of, uh, north light’s, like crafty, you know, thing. Anyway, Paul, I was telling her about you, so, um. Anyway, I was telling her about those Emma Carlisle books, and then I was like, Hmm, I’ve got some friends, or I’ve got a friend that’s a really good publication designer.

[01:14:56] So anyway, I’m always, uh, I’m [01:15:00] your, what do you call, I’m your pimp. I’m your pimp for, um, oh, 

[01:15:06] Amy Bryant: Strat. You’re their agents. Yeah. There. 

[01:15:08] diane: Well, I feel like I’m pimping out Paul, but not really. Yeah. You know, uh, it’s so I don’t have like a pack of paper, but you know, like if you buy a pack of Strathmore, it’s just a paper.

[01:15:18] Maybe y’all don’t have it in Norway, but it’s just a pack of paper. I mean, they’re a paper manufacturer. They also probably make brushes, but mainly they make sketchbooks and, and like, [01:15:30] this is a Strathmore Strathmore sketchbook. It’s tone tan. I love this one. Mm-Hmm. Anyway, she like, sometimes they’ll on a pad of paper, not a sketchbook.

[01:15:40] They’ll have like somebody’s art, you know, on there. ’cause, uh. Here’s what you could do with our stuff. She’s been that before. Anyway. The end. Amy’s gotta go. Her dog’s gotta go out, clearly. Jack’s gotta go out. Amy, I love you and everybody else. Love y’all too. I hope I see you next week and um, it’s just, [01:16:00] oh, Strathmore.

[01:16:00] Yeah. I don’t know, Maya. I don’t know, you know. Hey, mine did that. I don’t know. I can’t see what you can see. All 

[01:16:06] Amy Bryant: right, the end. Love you looking back. Thanks for having me. Bye everybody. Bye, Amy. Bye y’all.