Sketchbook Experiments with Steph Fizer Coleman

[00:00:00] diane: Hey everybody. Welcome to another episode of, of, I was about to say of Steph Fizer Coleman. ’cause I’m so excited. It’s, we’re changing the name again. It’s the show. I’m so excited. Um, when I got turned on to Steph and her work, her illustration, but it’s not just that. It’s also, she does some abstracts, but it’s how she uses her, [00:00:30] her, um, sketchbooks and she’s a great teacher, but she, I mean, that wasn’t, I didn’t mean a, but after that, just pause.

[00:00:38] She’s a great teacher as well. She is on the East coast. I think you’re in West Virginia, is that right? 

[00:00:44] Steph Fizer Coleman: I am, yeah. In, in West Virginia. 

[00:00:46] diane: And we are polka dot girls today. We didn’t mean to, but we worked it anyway. I am so. Jealous of her skills and her texture that she gets, [00:01:00] and just the fun she has. She just exudes joy to me.

[00:01:05] Her work is super joyful. So I’m super excited that we get to have stuff on and she’s gonna talk to us about how she uses her sketchbooks. I have always lots of questions, um, and I’ll try to get through them, but I always like to make sure that you guys get your questions into, so I know that Steph’s gonna share her screen and we’re gonna look at some stuff there as well.

[00:01:29] But [00:01:30] if I know I didn’t, you do children’s books, your author and an illustrator. You are an educator. You teach people, um, about right now you have the whole thing you’re about to launch a course with or a series on. Um, children’s book illustrators and there’s all this honest stuff that she’s sharing, which I think is great.

[00:01:53] So I know I didn’t cover everything, but can you give us a little bit of your background and a better intro than what I did? [00:02:00] 

[00:02:00] Steph Fizer Coleman: Sure. I thought that was a great intro. I feel like I wanna have you in my studio just like saying nice things about me all the time. I’ll be your heights girl. Yeah, just, just hang out and when I’m having a bad painting day, just be like, you’re awesome.

[00:02:14] Um, so yeah. Um, I am a children’s book illustrator, um, trying to be an author. Um, that, that is new to me. I’m writing my first picture books right now. Um, it is hard, so, um, that’s fun. [00:02:30] Um, I’m also, um, an online art educator, so I teach obviously about sketchbook practice, which is like why we’re here. Um, and then I have a class.

[00:02:39] It’s not really a class. Um, it’s, it’s a, we call it a portfolio development workshop. Um, it’s gonna launch this fall. It’s called Let’s Make Picture Books. Um, and it is for people who want to make picture books. It’s really fun. Um, we, um, I don’t wanna go on and on about it, but, but one 

[00:02:56] diane: thing I think is great is that you, you’ve done these [00:03:00] illustrations.

[00:03:00] You used your sketchbooks for ex, um, figuring out characters like sometimes Mm-Hmm. So it actually is totally relevant, but the one thing I, you do a, um, I don’t know why my brain isn’t working. I didn’t take my medicine this afternoon. Um, you know, the, uh, survey, you did a survey with children’s book illustrators, and I actually also thought that was really, so tell ’em about that and then, then you can give them the spiel again at the end too.

[00:03:27] But I think this, yeah, sure. If you wanna do children’s books, [00:03:30] this is a, this course would be great. 

[00:03:33] Steph Fizer Coleman: Yeah, so this, um, this thing, let’s make picture books. Um, you know, first of all, like, you know, my vibe is obviously to just be really honest about being a children’s book illustrator. I just feel like there are so many, like, shiny stars and unicorns around the idea of being a children’s book illustrator.

[00:03:49] And, I mean, with good reason. You know, it’s, it’s, it’s a wonderful thing to do. It’s amazing, it’s fulfilling. Like, it’s, it’s a lot of fun. But, um, I always make it a point to let [00:04:00] everyone know like how much money you could make per book, um, if you will earn royalties from your kids’ books, and if you will get rich off those royalties.

[00:04:08] And like, the answer to that is for most people, no for, you know, maybe like 3% of people. Yes. They’re, they’re rolling in royalties and then everybody else is like, you know, getting like, you know, a $500 royalty check. It’s like, if that, like that’s, that’s a good day. Um, so yeah, I always come from that place of just being really honest with everyone about like what is [00:04:30] possible.

[00:04:30] Um, and then let’s make picture books is less about learning to illustrate like I illustrate and more about learning to illustrate how you illustrate. So instead of having, you know, guided lessons that take you through a class, this one has workbooks. So we work in the class for 12 weeks every four weeks to get a workbook.

[00:04:49] And that workbook challenges you two do a lot of sketchbooks stuff first. That’s like, make some message, do some exploration, learn, you know, like learn what you really wanna say with your [00:05:00] illustration and then. Make the art. Um, so yeah, it’s, I I’m always just like on a soapbox about sketch booking 

[00:05:07] diane: and you’ve done tons of children’s books.

[00:05:09] And a couple of years ago, I don’t know exactly how many, ’cause I, I’ve, um, watched a whole bunch of YouTubes, which I know are out of order, but, um, but you actually kind of got, you were, you were getting burned out maybe on a certain style. And so then your sketchbooks really came into a different That’s true.

[00:05:29] They had a [00:05:30] different, uh, purpose. And I think that’s something we all can relate to is sometimes we just need to use them for, uh, 

[00:05:37] Steph Fizer Coleman: yeah, I don’t know, 

[00:05:38] diane: getting some different kind of fuel in the fire. Yeah, 

[00:05:42] Steph Fizer Coleman: like, it, it, um, it really, so I, gosh, it was, I went through a couple rounds of burnout when, with kids books.

[00:05:49] Um, just because I, you know, I had a hard time saying no when I first started, like really getting consistent book projects that were things I loved, you know, illustrating [00:06:00] animals, drawing birds, drawing ocean stuff. Like, I loved those things. I was so excited, you know, kids stuff would’ve loved these books.

[00:06:06] And that felt so good. So I just kept saying yes to everything. Um, and then eventually I just kind of got to this point where like, it felt like Groundhog Day. Like I, like, I was like, oh my gosh, this is like my sixth ocean book. Like, I can’t think of like a different way to draw a coral reef. And like, there’s, there’s only like so many ways I can draw this whale, you know?

[00:06:27] And I was like, oh my gosh. Like I gotta, I gotta do something [00:06:30] different. And I. At that point, I was working very digital. I was, you know, doing most of my work in Photoshop, and I was working long hours and, you know, my body was like, what is happening? It was like, like my whole left arm was just like, I’m gonna go on strike if we keep doing this.

[00:06:46] Um, so I kind of knew I needed to change something and I was really sick of being on my cente all the time, so I was like, you know what, man, let’s, let’s just like do a fun sketchbook, because I had always, of course, like sketched on paper, but as part of my [00:07:00] process for doing books and, you know, greeting cards and stuff like that.

[00:07:03] But it had been like years since I had a sketchbook that was just for like, messing around, you know? Mm. So I started doing that maybe like five or six years ago. Um, and that was like a big turning point for me. Like I, I learned again that I like using like, you know, markers and pencils and paint and like, you know, I, I was able to kind of see like.

[00:07:27] What I liked on paper and then [00:07:30] figure out like, okay, well, like for illustration, how does that work? Um, ’cause I know I don’t wanna do like fully traditional for kids books because I gotta edit and all that stuff, and I would rather be able to Photoshop it. Um, so then I was able to like, you know, say, okay, like, here’s what I love in my sketchbooks, here’s what I know in Photoshop.

[00:07:48] Like, how do these two things work together? And now I have like a style that kind of like brings like the best of both worlds. Like, I get like the spontaneity of like, some analog work, but I can still edit things if I [00:08:00] need to. So that’s really nice. And I, I wouldn’t, I mean, I tried to get there without, you know, a sketchbook.

[00:08:07] I tried to, you know, find a, an easier style and a different style and I just couldn’t, it took like being willing to get in a sketchbook and make some stuff that wasn’t pretty, I, you know, to like really understand. Um. What I wanted from my creative practice going forward. So 

[00:08:29] diane: goes [00:08:30] books. What about, what about materials?

[00:08:31] So like, were you already, did you already have those like Karen Dash, uh, things or different markers or was this something you were like trying as you went? 

[00:08:44] Steph Fizer Coleman: So, funny story about that, um, is that like every artist I had stacks and stacks of materials and then at some point a few years ago, um, I was like, man, like everything you’re doing is mostly digital.

[00:08:56] So like you really don’t need all this stuff. Like you need some [00:09:00] sketchbooks. A couple kinds of pencils, you know? Um, and then I had some, I had some neo collars that I was using just to like sketch with, ’cause that feels nice to me. Um, but then when I decided I wanted to get back into a sketchbook practice again, I was like, oh man, I gotta buy this.

[00:09:15] Like, all this stuff that, like, I gave away, I’m gonna have to buy it again. Like, so I started, um, I was, you know, when I started out, I was watching, um, a lot of Patreon. I was watching like, um, I think like Emma Carlisle and like those [00:09:30] people. So I would be like, okay man, let’s, let’s try some luminance colored pencils and see what happens.

[00:09:35] Like, let’s try some Ecoline brush pens and see what happens. And then I was, you know, slowly able to find the stuff that I liked and, you know, kind of like, uh, focus on that instead of worrying about like, you know, what everybody else was using and doing and all that stuff. So, so yeah, it’s, it’s only just like, buy everything again.

[00:09:53] So That’s so funny. 

[00:09:55] diane: Five years ago when you decided, you were like, okay, I’m gonna go [00:10:00] back analog. And you even talk about this in one of the videos. You’re like, I used my non-dominant hand, which is Right. That would be your right hand. ’cause you’re left hand. Yeah, I’m right handed. Yeah. Um, and, and so it’s like.

[00:10:11] You were drawing with that other, and sometimes I guess could be out of the need because your arm is burning. But, um, it’s, I think it’s really, that’s even a, a small, um, thing that we can do sometimes I think using a different tool that we’re not [00:10:30] used to, or, um, a, a brush that’s all funky, so you have this broken brush that you use the back end of it as a, as a tool.

[00:10:39] And I think, you know, maybe, maybe you’re like, I’m not gonna buy anymore. I already gave this one broke. Now I have two. I don’t know. But I think that that also is really interesting that you’re utilizing the things that are there. You’re investing in some other tools or some other materials, but, um, lots of [00:11:00] times, uh, it looks like you’re using a limited palette and you’re, you also push through to some you love blue and orange, which.

[00:11:09] I went to Auburn, so that’s, uh, blue and orange. I love when you say that I’m a blue and orange girl too. Um, but the, but you will still do stuff in like purple and yellow, which is I think your evil colors. I do it so much. 

[00:11:23] Steph Fizer Coleman: I do it so much. I don’t know why I do it every, you know, ’cause like some [00:11:30] days, like you, you know that you need a challenge when you show up to make art.

[00:11:33] And on those days I choose purple and yellow, so I’m like, you don’t like these? Uh, but I mean, I, I don’t like, like, you know, like pure hued, like purple and yellow, but I like a yellow ochre and like a dark moody purple. Like those are fine. Um, but yeah, I’ve. I have found, um, that when I started my sketchbook practice, it was very helpful for me to like limit things.

[00:11:56] Um, ’cause we get overwhelmed, you know, if you’ve got 10,000 [00:12:00] things to choose from, you’re just gonna sit there and like, oh, like I don’t, I don’t know. But if you have, you know, two pencils and a tube of paint, then you have to like, you know, okay, what can I do with this? And I’ve always found that when you.

[00:12:12] Have those limitations. Like at first, you know, you, like, if you’re listening right now, you might think like, oh, like that sounds like that’s gonna not be fun at all. But then you find out that it is, because if there’s something that you wanna do and you don’t have like the material that you would normally use, then you figure out, okay, like what can I do [00:12:30] here?

[00:12:30] I thin this paint down. Can I use this to paint with? Like, what can I use for a texture? Like, you figure out so many things that you wouldn’t have figured out if you were using like 10,000 different materials. Um, so like, just like any sort of limitations you can give yourself, you know, like maybe you’re just.

[00:12:46] Using a brush that day. Maybe you’re just using one brush, maybe it’s just, you know, one colored pencil. Maybe you limit your color palette. Um, for a long time I would choose a color palette and stick with it for like a week or two, no [00:13:00] matter what I was drawing in my sketchbook. So like, it didn’t, it didn’t matter if the bird wasn’t those colors, we were gonna use those colors, like, figure out how this works.

[00:13:08] And it was a really good exercise. Um, it was just, it just made everything so much easier for me, um, when I was, you know, when you’re starting out and you’re building that new habit, you have to just really get out of your own way. And for me, that just means like making things really easy. So if I had my sketchbook out on my drawing desk back there, and I already had my markers chosen and my pencils chosen and everything is just there, [00:13:30] then when I come in my studio in the morning, I’m like, oh, okay.

[00:13:32] Like I’ll just, I’ll do 15 minutes of my sketchbook and see what happens. And there’s, there’s no struggle. There’s no feeling bad, there’s no stressing out over it. It’s just, it’s already ready and, and inviting you. So, 

[00:13:43] diane: so that makes a good point too, is that, so limited tools, um, limited time. And then sometimes when we’re working in, you work with water soluble things, lots.

[00:13:56] Mm-Hmm. Or, um, and so sometimes the pages [00:14:00] get wet and you can’t keep going. So in 15 minutes you need a different. Book. Mm-Hmm. Do you have now, for people who are just starting, that may be like, oh my gosh, how many sketchbooks do I have to buy? But for those of us who are right in the middle and we have multiples, is that, um, how many do you have?

[00:14:20] Kind of going at a time? 

[00:14:23] Steph Fizer Coleman: So many. Um, I would, I counted before we started, because I figured you were gonna ask, and I have, I [00:14:30] have seven right now. Um, but I don’t draw, you know, I, I think I’m weirdly superstitious. So like, if I have a bad, bad, bad day in a sketchbook, I’m like, okay, you’re gonna go back on the shelf.

[00:14:44] We’re gonna pick a different one instead and see if we can just like, you know, loosen up the vibes and hear a little bit. Um, so I do that a lot. Um, I used to be really like, I used to have like a sketchbook for birds and one for animals and one for flowers. And now I just have like. A stack of [00:15:00] sketchbooks and I just swap around.

[00:15:03] Um, like if I’m waiting on something to dry, then I’ll switch to a different sketchbook. Sometimes if I’m waiting on something to dry, I’ll just grab a little, I have somewhere back here a little stack of like, um, four by five paper. Um, that I just, I cut down to size and sometimes I’ll just grab one of those and then just, you know, do a little painting or use the last of my paint or whatever, and then I will like stick it in a sketchbook or like tape it to a page or something.

[00:15:29] It’s, [00:15:30] um, but I mean, you don’t need seven sketchbooks, it’s just, 

[00:15:34] diane: but you might need more than one if you’re gonna use something. I would say it two, 

[00:15:37] Steph Fizer Coleman: honestly. Yeah. Okay. If you’re using, if you’re using anything like wash or like watercolors, shoot, even acrylics, you know, you have to wait a couple minutes for them to dry Sometimes.

[00:15:47] Um, even markers like the, the Ecoline markers that I like, they’re very like juicy markers. Mm-Hmm. So like, you gotta wait a minute before you start trying to put a colored pencil over that, or you were going through the page is [00:16:00] happening. Yeah. So, yeah, I think it’s nice to have two to work on and. If you’re working on multiple things at the same time, like if you’ve got a couple of paintings or a couple of illustrations or drawings or whatever, you feel less precious about this one right here because you can just bounce over here for a second and then bounce back and you just don’t get so like laser focused on this has to be perfect or the world will end.

[00:16:25] It’s just a nice, nice little break to bounce back and forth and not get so [00:16:30] uptight, which is. What I’m always trying to fight against, because I am uptight as a person, like I’m an anxious little bunny. So when it comes to my sketchbook practice, I’m always having to think of like, like things like the non-dominant hand thing.

[00:16:45] Um, things like, you know, using, using tools. Like I never sketch, like if I’m, even if I’m just like sketching, like if I sat down and I was like, oh, I wanna sketch chicky, I would probably pick up a neo color because it has less, it affords me less [00:17:00] control than picking up a pencil. And like, I used to be a mechanical pencil sketcher, and it’s just, I, I am just too tight with those.

[00:17:07] So if anything that I can do to just like loosen up and, you know, let it be more fun and free, like that’s what I’m doing, but I’m always fighting against like who I am as a 

[00:17:18] diane: person. Well, and I think that that’s a really good point, and I think for a lot of us are designers and we’re, um, in having a, we may not.

[00:17:28] Um, we may [00:17:30] not think of ourselves as illustrators even. Um, or it may be something that we’ve developed over time, but most of the time we’re working digitally and it is a place to have more. The sketchbook is a place for more, um, exploration and not Mm-Hmm. Not something that has to be so perfect, which I think is great.

[00:17:49] I love, uh, took the a bunch of time this weekend and just watched a whole bunch of her videos, um, on YouTube, which I will share that the links of her [00:18:00] YouTube channels, but it is, there are, it’s not all perfect. She’s like, I’m, I, we were talking before I was most not. I’m like, oh, no, stop, stop. You know, you can see when someone else is, is going too far, but then she.

[00:18:15] She does it, it goes okay. And, and it’s just, but it’s good that I can see it in someone else. ’cause I obviously can’t, I can’t see it in myself sometimes. So I think it’s good to watch. But I also love that you keep those in because it helps us to know [00:18:30] that everything that comes out of your hand isn’t just this most amazing, beautiful thing and that you, it, it’s nice to see the struggle, um, that it’s not just me, you know?

[00:18:42] ’cause I think sometimes we look at people on, um, YouTube or wherever and it’s like, oh my gosh, these sketchbooks are amazing. And they are amazing. They, they’re, but I think they’re just flipping over some of the pages that maybe aren’t so great, or they didn’t show the bad sketchbook or something. [00:19:00] So in, so what would you say to somebody who, um, hasn’t.

[00:19:05] Doesn’t have a sketchbook practice, and they say that they one of two things, they can’t draw or they don’t have time. 

[00:19:15] Steph Fizer Coleman: So the time one is easy, um, because everyone has 15 minutes. Like you, it’s, it’s not that much time. Um, either if you have a dedicated space, like I do have your stuff setting out so that you can just come to your space, set a [00:19:30] timer for 15 minutes, go for it.

[00:19:32] Um, you know, if you don’t have that, keep all of your sketchbook stuff in, uh, in a box, in a bag, whatever. So that when you have your 15 minutes, you can sit down, get it out on the kitchen table. Do it. You know? Um, and also just a side note, I saw Troy in the comments say that beautiful sketchbooks are meant to be beautiful sketchbooks.

[00:19:51] Like they’re meant to be works of art. And I think he is a hundred percent right. That’s what I think too. And I think that that is absolutely valid, you know, to have a sketchbook that is meant to be a work of [00:20:00] art. I think that’s wonderful. I just don’t think it’s, for me, those are all blank. 

[00:20:04] diane: I’m like, oh, this was a really nice sketchbook.

[00:20:06] I’ll save that for when I’m ready. 

[00:20:08] Steph Fizer Coleman: Well see. I’m the opposite though. I buy beautiful sketchbooks and then I just make big messes in them. And I’m like, well, this, like, it’s, that’s what it’s there for. Like the sketchbook exists to hold art. It’s not gonna judge the art that you put in the sketchbook, you know?

[00:20:25] So like, just, just make art in the sketchbook. Like that’s what it’s for. It’s, it’s meant for that. [00:20:30] Make your sketchbook happy. Put some stuff in it. Yeah. Let let that sketchbook be fulfilled. 

[00:20:36] diane: So what would you say to somebody who says that they can’t draw? Because I think it’s really about, to me it’s about seeing, and you don’t have to make, if you can make a circle or you can make a letter B, then you can draw.

[00:20:47] I think 

[00:20:48] Steph Fizer Coleman: absolutely. I mean, I think that it depends on like what you want as an artist. If you, you know, I have been, um, developing an abstract painting sketchbook practice [00:21:00] over the last like few months, and you don’t need to know how to draw to do that. All you have to do is figure out how you like the, the paints you like, the materials you like, and how you like to make marks on a page.

[00:21:13] And that’s it. You can make art. You, you don’t, you don’t need, you don’t need to know how to do that. Um, but if you think that you can’t draw, the thing that is gonna help you learn how to draw is wait for it actually drawing. So like, get in your sketchbook, do your 15 minutes. [00:21:30] Know that when you are, if you’re new to drawing, if you’re new to making art, it’s probably gonna suck at first.

[00:21:36] Like you’re, I mean, it is, you are not gonna be able to get the things that are in your head out onto the paper. And like some days that’s gonna feel really annoying, but I think that every. Every single time that you sit down to make some art in your sketchbook, you’re doing yourself a favor as an artist.

[00:21:52] You’re gonna grow in skill, you’re gonna grow in confidence. And like, I always make it a point to find something that [00:22:00] I like in everything that I do, every piece of art that I do. So if I have the worst day ever in my sketchbook and I’m like, oh my gosh, like, am I even an artist? Like, why do people pay me for arch?

[00:22:10] Like, this makes no sense. I will say, okay, like, what’s, what’s good about this? And sometimes it’s like a smudge of color in a corner. Sometimes it’s like an eyebrow. Sometimes it’s, you know, a finger on a character or something. Like even the the tiniest thing though, that helps me. Show up the next time. Mm.

[00:22:29] [00:22:30] Instead of looking at that sketchbook page and being like, oh, I suck. Like I’m no good. Everybody else is so much better than me. Like if I, if I’m doing all the negative self-talk, then I’m not gonna wanna come back the next day. I’m not gonna wanna keep trying. But if I’m finding those little moments of like, like, yes, I really like that.

[00:22:46] And that also helps because when you make note of those little things that you like, you’re tucking that into the little folds of your brain and then they’ll be available the next time you make some art. You remember? Oh yeah. I really liked that. Pretty peachy pink color. So I’m gonna try that [00:23:00] again. I really liked that brush stroke.

[00:23:02] So like, I’m gonna try that again. Um, it’s just such a nice practice to just be nice to yourself and to your art, 

[00:23:08] diane: you know? So I had that question way down. So I’m gonna skip to question number. No, I’m good. This is the way I think I have a DD so we’re good. We can skip all around. Um, how do you deal with making bad art and is your internal voice.

[00:23:23] Nice or mean. 

[00:23:24] Steph Fizer Coleman: So I would say that like naturally, unfortunately, my internal [00:23:30] voice is kind of a meany. It’s like kind of meany. Um, just, I, I am by nature cynical as a, just like a person. So I’m always kind of like trying to balance that out with being a little bit less cynical, you know? Um, but definitely the, the tendency for me is to like be, not mean to myself, but just me.

[00:23:51] Maybe like not super nice. Um, so it’s taken years of practice to stop doing that, you know, and I’ll still catch myself [00:24:00] doing it sometimes and be like, oh, stop that. You know, like my, my general rule for. Me, especially with, you know, my art and judging my art is, would I say that to a friend? Yeah. You know, if, if I wouldn’t say that to a friend, I have no business saying it to myself either, so, so I’m like, would you say that to a friend?

[00:24:19] No. Okay. And then now let’s find something that is good about this. I love that. And it really just like, it really just changes the whole perspective of the thing. Like if you’ve had the worst art [00:24:30] day, art week, art month, you know, ever. If you just take a second to be like, okay, like this one thing, I like this, you know, like, I like this.

[00:24:38] And it just feels so nice to just, you know, be nice to yourself, be nice to your art, and it makes you wanna come back and work and get better at the thing. So 

[00:24:47] diane: I love that. So I don’t know if you wanna share your screen, you wanna show ’em some stuff and then I can keep asking some questions. So this is, do you, this is just a.

[00:24:58] Personal, me being [00:25:00] nosy. Um, if you weren’t going to a meeting or you had to go to a doctor’s appointment or something and would you carry your sketchbook? And a couple of little things. 

[00:25:12] Steph Fizer Coleman: So I wrote a blog post about this once. Um, but this is like a two-parter. Um, first of all, I just think that waiting rooms are the worst places on earth.

[00:25:25] Like just, I, I don’t love a waiting room. And when [00:25:30] I’m in a waiting room, I’m normally just gonna like, put my AirPods in and listen to like an audiobook or something and pretend I’m not there. Um, so I don’t usually bring anything. Now I will have like one of those tiny little like mole skin sketchbooks.

[00:25:43] Mm-Hmm. I keep that tucked in my purse so that if I’m feeling, you know, inspired and I wanna scribble something down. Wait, wait, 

[00:25:52] diane: you gotta go back ’cause I gotta ask a question about the owl. I mean, you’re gonna have to, you can just go wherever I but there this to the [00:26:00] owl? Yeah, if possible. That’s okay.

[00:26:02] Okay. So. Well, I don’t wanna interrupt you for finishing the rest of what you were saying. 

[00:26:08] Steph Fizer Coleman: Oh, I’ll finish what I, okay. And then we’ll talk about the, the, the owl that’s on the screen right now. Um, so, um, I, as far as like drawing on location, I love watching other people do it. Like, show me YouTube videos all day long of people packing up their kids and going out and whatever.

[00:26:25] Um, but like, if it’s me, I really don’t like it just, I don’t like [00:26:30] it. I felt bad about it for so long ’cause I was like, oh, like you’re not like a real sketchbook artist because you don’t wanna like, you know, go draw, you know, at the park or in the woods, whatever. Um, but I just, you know, it’s different strokes for different folks.

[00:26:44] And like, you know, I would rather be in my studio, so it’s more common for me to like, take a bunch of photos of stuff. Mm-Hmm. And then to like, write some notes in my notes app, because we all know that like a photo is not the same as actually like looking at the thing. So like, if I take a photo, then I [00:27:00] might make some notes about like, oh, I thought this texture was really interesting, or I thought these colors were amazing, or here’s what the color looked like, or Here’s how I think the color, how I could make the color.

[00:27:09] Um, so I do that. Um, I just, you know, like I said, it’s just not for me. So if, if y’all don’t like drawing a location and it’s totally fine. 

[00:27:19] diane: Yeah. I think that that’s good to, good to know in that it’s just the permission again that you don’t always have to do it the way other people are doing it. You have to do.

[00:27:29] The way that [00:27:30] you’re gonna actually show up and make work. So one of the questions I had was, um, how, when do you take it out of the sketchbook? Like how do you know? So in, on dis on Christmas day in 2020, you were drawing this owl. Was the owl, you were, was it for a book or was it, you had an idea of this bigger thing, you just came up with this super cute owl and then you made this, it was.

[00:27:56] Steph Fizer Coleman: Yeah, it was for nothing. Um, I was just, it [00:28:00] was Christmas and I’m sure we were in between things for the day, you know, like we had done like Christmas morning stuff, and then we were doing afternoon stuff with one of our families, so I was just kinda like putzing around and I was like, oh, I’m gonna go draw for a little bit.

[00:28:14] Um, and I didn’t even really know what I was gonna draw. Um, but I was really into, and I’m still into, um, negative space. So I did this owl and I was like, oh gosh, like he’s really something. Like, I love this dude. So I was like, eh, let’s like make a [00:28:30] thing. And then I spent, I mean, it took, you know, a few days to like, make an illustration.

[00:28:34] You know, I, I sketched out, I sketched out my idea for like these owls like flying over this little snowy village. Um, and then a lot of this illustration, this was. Also when I was figuring out my analog and digital illustration style. So this was one of the illustrations that I used to learn how I wanted to do that and what worked for me.

[00:28:55] So this was a lot of like painting, like everything was painted on [00:29:00] paper and then scanned at a Photoshop and then edited and then assembled and recolored and all that stuff. Um, so yeah, it was just, it was just a feeling with that. Um, now, like with kids book stuff, um, I’m gonna go back to my, to my own slides here.

[00:29:14] Yeah, yeah. Like this. Is like something that I would do for kids’ books like this is like how I would work for kids’ books. Um, and this is another example of what I would do, um, with a kid’s book where I know starting out, like with thi this one is, [00:29:30] uh, the book was called One Day This Tree Will Fall And it’s the story of a Douglas fir and all of the life that it supports throughout its life.

[00:29:38] And then after it falls and you know, becomes part of the forest floor, it’s really beautiful. It had all these animals in it. So I spent probably like a month or so just filling up this sketchbook with different animals that were gonna be in there. Um, and that’s, you know, that’s why I’ve always used sketchbooks in this really specific way.

[00:29:57] But then, um, with something like these [00:30:00] owls that I have over here, this was just an accident. Um, I was just sketching, just doing fun stuff. And then was like, oh, this. This could be a thing. 

[00:30:09] diane: Well, another thing I love is that, um, it is a limited palette over there on the left hand side, and you use your shadow color, a weird shadow color, but I love the weird shadow colors that you choose because it just.

[00:30:25] Sometimes shadows are weird colors and it helps it to, that is one of the [00:30:30] joy things. I’m like, did she only have that c foam green and she just plopped it on? Or she’s like, I’m gonna make the shadow fun with c foam green. You know, like, 

[00:30:39] Steph Fizer Coleman: I would say both. Um, I would say like during this time I was probably working with like that, um, that’s probably like a Prussian blue.

[00:30:47] Um, and then the, the greenish color, I forget, I forget which one it is. Um, it’s a luminance pencil, so I was probably working with those and the yellows above that. Um, so that’s what I had, um, at the time. But also, [00:31:00] like, one of the fun things about illustrating for kids is that like, you can make it weird like that, you know?

[00:31:06] Yeah. And it’s, it’s acceptable. Now I’m just regretting that I didn’t carry it over into the illustration. It just makes it like, I think that I intended to, but then like, once I got into the illustration, I was like, oh, this doesn’t really work the same way that like, you know, it, it doesn’t feel the same.

[00:31:22] It did. 

[00:31:22] diane: I also love his determined eye in the sketch. Yeah, I know. And then you, you were like, Nope, that looks a little too hard. I [00:31:30] got 

[00:31:30] Steph Fizer Coleman: rid of it because every owl that I draw on my sketchbook looks cranky. It’s a thing. It’s, it’s a thing. So when I did them, I was like, oh, let’s make them look like this is like a peaceful sort of, sort of, they look beautiful.

[00:31:43] So seen. It’s a different vibe, 

[00:31:45] diane: but it’s, it’s a good, um, exercise for us to see, oh, here’s what it started as. Even you have the little houses and the other little circles that in your mind, I know are something else. But, and then as it, [00:32:00] as it, I don’t know, um. Uh, transforms. Mm-hmm. Into the final piece. We see how some of the things change and we see how maybe a decision was made so that he didn’t look so cranky.

[00:32:14] Anyway, I think that’s great. 

[00:32:17] Steph Fizer Coleman: So many cranky owls in my sketchbook. 

[00:32:20] diane: Orange and blue again. We got it. And I love these little dogs. 

[00:32:25] Steph Fizer Coleman: So these are for, um, this was from like last month. Um, I’m working [00:32:30] on developing a book idea that has dogs and a couple of dogs. So there’s like a, an older sort of grump of a, a big dog.

[00:32:39] And then this little sort of like yappy crazy, um, sort of, sort of talk is his, is his counterpart. So I’m working on those now. Um, birds. 

[00:32:53] diane: And you draw birds a lot as just like a go-to, right? 

[00:32:58] Steph Fizer Coleman: Yeah. So 

[00:32:59] diane: much. So is it [00:33:00] about birds that you love? 

[00:33:02] Steph Fizer Coleman: So I’ve just always, always loved birds. Um, just, I, I don’t remember like, not like noticing birds a lot.

[00:33:10] Probably more than the average person. And when I was, when I was starting out in kids’ books a million years ago, um, in like 2015, I was like, it feels like a million years now. Um, I was trying to like find my style because I felt like my, the work I was doing then was just very like [00:33:30] cookie cutter, you know?

[00:33:31] It was very much kind of like this is a kid’s book portfolio and it didn’t really have a voice or anything, so. I decided I was gonna do, um, a weekly drawing project because back then we weren’t all crazy. I was trying to draw for a hundred days in a row. Right. No shame. ’cause I’ve done that one too. I did that one twice.

[00:33:52] But back then I was doing, um, just a weekly project. I called it 52 Birds. ’cause I’m very clever and I [00:34:00] just decided that I was gonna draw one bird every week for the entire year. Um, I really think that I picked them though because like the shapes are easy. If you know how to draw one bird, you know how to draw the rest of the birds.

[00:34:11] They just, you just have to vary the size of the body and the shape of the head and whatever. But if you have like the general idea of how to draw a bird, you can draw a bird. Um, so I figured they were simple enough that it would not feel intimidating to me. Um, and that it would give me a really good base to try to figure out [00:34:30] like who I was as an artist.

[00:34:31] Um, and it actually worked. Um, I spent that year. Doing those bird illustrations and then at the end of the year, the cool thing about a project like that is when you look at them all together at the end you can really see the progression of like, I didn’t know what I was doing here. And then I, like, I had totally figured it out by the end.

[00:34:49] So like that was lovely. Um, and I, I sent them to my agent at the time, my kids book agent and was like, Hey, like I’ve been doing these, like, what do you think? Um, and she suggested of course that I do some full [00:35:00] scenes because you have to like show that you can draw backgrounds and interaction and motion and all that stuff.

[00:35:04] So, um, I took some birds and I developed a few illustrations with them and I started like. Within like a couple of months I started getting the kinds of books I really wanted to do. Uh, so like, I was like, yes. Um, and then I just, you know, I just really loved drawing birds, so I just kept at it, you know, it was, it was all digital for a long time.

[00:35:27] And then when I started my sketchbook practice, it [00:35:30] was the easiest thing to start with. You know, this, um, this runner duck that’s on the screen on the right hand side was in one of my first sketchbooks. Um, and it was just, it’s a really comfortable subject matter, you know, you already know how to draw it and now you get to figure out like, okay, like what materials do I like and how do I do textures on a page and like, you know, all this fun stuff.

[00:35:49] So they just, I just love birds. 

[00:35:52] diane: Well, and, and a lot of, so, and looking from left to right and I just know, ’cause I’ve watched a whole bunch of you painting, [00:36:00] but I think it’s interesting sometimes you’re just starting with these kind of. Um, big shapes. Blobs. Yeah. Blos. They’re 

[00:36:09] Steph Fizer Coleman: just blobs. Um, 

[00:36:10] diane: and then you’re making, um, you’re adding something else.

[00:36:15] And I think it is a, it’s a way that for me and the way my brain works, it’s a relief because you can connect, um, with a line where there wasn’t maybe the color. And it still makes [00:36:30] sense. Yeah. And they’re just way more fun, um, than trying this super tight. But I mean, the duck looks totally different than the other birds, you know, like he’s taller and he’s, I mean, he’s so cute and like smiling.

[00:36:45] Looks like he’s about to wink at me, but like, looks 

[00:36:47] Steph Fizer Coleman: like he’s about to get into something. 

[00:36:50] diane: So, so if you’ve done, like, so if you were doing, uh, one bird for a whole week, right? Like, like say it was a duck. Was it a [00:37:00] duck? You did a duck a week. 

[00:37:02] Steph Fizer Coleman: Oh, well, so when I was doing 52 Birds, it was a different bird every week.

[00:37:07] Right. And I was only doing one drawing a week. 

[00:37:08] diane: Oh, okay. Because that, I was like, did you do seven ducks or 15? No, I wasn’t. Okay. Yeah. 

[00:37:13] Steph Fizer Coleman: It wasn’t a daily drawing. They see we’re also broken like by Instagram drawing projects that are like, you will do this every day. Like, 

[00:37:22] diane: okay, that makes, so then you ended up, yeah.

[00:37:25] But they, you ended up with 52 different birds. Mm-Hmm. 

[00:37:28] Steph Fizer Coleman: Okay. I just, [00:37:30] um, I made a list. Um, I, I love a list again to like, you know, you gotta give yourself some limitations, um, ’cause there are something like 10,000 birds in the world, um, which is too many to choose from. So instead I just like, I think I just like maybe did a Google search, like a Google image search for like birds.

[00:37:48] And then just was like, oh, I like this one. I like this one. You know? And then I, you know, chose like birds that I knew from my own backyard and, you know, noticing them. So, had a list and then by the end of it I had [00:38:00] 52 different birds. Um, 

[00:38:01] diane: so in, in that one project, what kinds of things were you. Did you have an idea of, oh, I’m gonna do birds and I’m gonna experiment with blank?

[00:38:12] Or was it just more freeform, like, I’m just drawing birds and we’re gonna see where it goes? Like 

[00:38:17] Steph Fizer Coleman: it was, it was really because like I already had a way that I worked, um, and, and this was in Photoshop at the time, I was still a digital girl, so I already had a way [00:38:30] that I worked and I was kind of thinking of that.

[00:38:34] Plus, um, one of my favorite illustrators, um, is Charlie Harper. Um, he was a mid-century illustrator who just like simplified everything Mm-Hmm. In the most amazing way. Like, I saw an exhibition of his work like three or four years ago, and like, you just like, just seeing like, just the, the simplicity and the perfection of the curves and all that stuff.

[00:38:57] Like, it was just so [00:39:00] I really wanted to simplify my own illustration work. Like that’s, and that’s that, I mean, that’s a thread that goes from way back then when I started that project to now is like, how can I simplify things? Because I, you know, I don’t just overthink everything. I also over illustrate everything.

[00:39:18] Like it, it takes a, it takes practice to learn how to do less in your art. Um, and I think that so often people don’t respect how hard that is. I didn’t, [00:39:30] 

[00:39:30] diane: it is hard for sure. I 

[00:39:31] Steph Fizer Coleman: didn’t, um, so yeah, when I was doing the 52 Birds Project, I was very much just kind of keeping in mind like the simplicity of Charlie Harper, how I could bring that into my own work.

[00:39:41] Um, and then, you know, as I’ve been a sketchbook artist, like that comes up over and over again is how can I simplify things? How can I make this fun? How can I make this easier? Um, and that was part of, you know, like these, these other, um, two pages of birds that we’re looking at on the screen right now.

[00:39:58] You know, I just, like you said, I a [00:40:00] lot of times will just go in and make blobs. Then we’ll turn that into a bird. Um, and this is something that I like, teach my students in, um, like my kids book class is like, figure out what the bare minimum of details are to identify a thing. So like I know that a bird has to have a beak and eye, two legs, a tail, and two wings.

[00:40:21] I can take any shape and make that into a bird. As long as it has those things, the, the human eye is gonna be like, oh, it’s a bird. Like, it doesn’t matter [00:40:30] if I just drew a triangle on the page, or if I just like threw a blob of paint down, I can turn that into a bird. And it’s such a fun challenge. And because you’re not drawing something like directly from a reference photo, you know, like you might like the, uh, this page that has like the blue tits on it, on the left, like of course I looked at a reference to understand like where the markings go on the bird, what color is its head, all that stuff.

[00:40:53] But it. Wasn’t like I was trying to be realistic with it. So I have a lot more room for play because I’m not [00:41:00] saying like, I have to draw this bird exactly as it exists in the wild. I’m like, no, I’m just gonna draw some shapes and put some lines together and you’re gonna know what it is. 

[00:41:08] diane: But that’s even a challenge, especially for somebody so detailed or, or you know, like, um, a lot of designers are OCD on certain things and so then it, it can be hard and it sounds like you fit right in there with us.

[00:41:22] And then, so to really abandon that and have, we have the basics, it’s, I’m not gonna be so [00:41:30] uptight, but that’s what gives it such life. Which is something I love. Paul had a great question. Paul’s a book designer, an awesome book designer. He does adult books and then he also has done kids books. And one of the things that he has, um, struggled with when he is working with illustrators, or maybe not, but it’s something, um, when, when do you, when do you plan for the text?

[00:41:53] As a book designer, I found many illustrators struggle with leaving. You’ve gotta stop moving. ’cause I want, I, I wanna see [00:42:00] all these things and I have to read his thing. Um, as a book designer, I’ve found many illustrators struggle with leaving the necessary negative space and extending backgrounds far enough if needed, for bleeds for the wider layout and concern.

[00:42:12] Like when do you plan, if, if these were for a book, how would you then, I mean obviously you’ve done enough books that you know how to do this, but how, what would you give if somebody has a. Because that is a challenge. Well, 

[00:42:28] Steph Fizer Coleman: so Paul, you’ll be happy to [00:42:30] know that I do teach my students to leave space for text.

[00:42:32] So, so I have got your back out there. Um, I leave, I build the space for text in when I do the sketches. So sometimes publishers will send the page layouts with the text already, you know, blocked out. I can move it around if I need to. Um, so that lets me know I need to leave like this much space, um, around this.

[00:42:56] And I do it at the sketch stage. I just go ahead and take care of it. I also go [00:43:00] ahead and set up my bleed, like my margins and everything at the sketch phase, so I know what everything needs to look like, how much needs to be on the page, how much is going off. Um. I like to be prepared, man. Like, I don’t wanna have to go back and do stuff later.

[00:43:15] Like, I don’t wanna, I don’t wanna mess it up and then have to like, go back and fix it. Um, 

[00:43:20] diane: yeah. Do you think about the gutter too? Like what’s Oh, yeah, of course. Ing over the gutter of, okay. 

[00:43:25] Steph Fizer Coleman: Yeah. Yeah. I always pay attention, um, to the gutter and how close I can be to it. How [00:43:30] much of it is swallowed up by the, the binding?

[00:43:32] Um, yeah, I always keep it in mind and just, uh, I mean, I’ve been doing it so long now, I’m just like, yeah, it’s easy. I always did it. Um, I’m sure that in my first couple of books, like I really just was super anxious about getting it all right, making sure that like, you know, I had enough bleed and I wasn’t putting things in the gutter and like, you know, so, so yeah, I, I try to be prepared, but maybe Paul 

[00:43:56] diane: could provide a little dummy.

[00:43:57] Where the text is. And [00:44:00] then 

[00:44:00] Steph Fizer Coleman: honestly like, you know, I, I think also like a lot of, especially new illustrators, I think that they’re afraid to ask questions. I think that like, they feel like they’re not gonna be viewed as professional if they say, you know, where do I put the text? Or can you, the, I remember the first book that I did, I asked them for a template with that had the bleed blocked in and the line for the gutter because I was doing it myself in [00:44:30] Photoshop and I was afraid I wasn’t getting it right.

[00:44:31] Right. And I just said, Hey guys, like, do you have a template? And I’m like, can you guys send me something? And they sent me something and it was really helpful. Um, so I guess it could be helpful to just, you know, ask, ask the illustrator if they need a template or layout or anything like that. Or if they feel comfortable, you know, that’s less work for everyone in the end, I guess.

[00:44:51] diane: I love these and I love that you’re filling up the page and these are. Um, thinner paper, but you don’t care. You’re like, [00:45:00] I’m okay. You don’t care. I really 

[00:45:02] Steph Fizer Coleman: don’t. I love that, that these are, um, these are, um, moleskin, um, blank Kaye notebooks. Um, so the paper is super thin. It’s not really meant to be a sketchbook.

[00:45:12] Um, I’ve used them for years for kids books. So like when I start a kids’ book, I’ll usually grab one of these and then I just, I’m usually sketching with like a colored pencil or an neo color so I don’t have to worry about it. Um, but then sometimes I do marker like this and it bleeds through. But I think it’s kind of fun to be able to see like the, the ghosts.

[00:45:29] [00:45:30] Yeah. Like the ghost of the birds who are on the next page. 

[00:45:34] diane: I love that. Okay, keep going. You can keep flipping that. I just wanted to be able to look too. All 

[00:45:41] Steph Fizer Coleman: right. You ask questions. 

[00:45:42] diane: So multiple, these are multiple different, um, uh, mediums, right? As you’re doing these. Yeah. I love these birds. These would make such great, like stuffy animals.[00:46:00] 

[00:46:01] Steph Fizer Coleman: They would, they would. 

[00:46:02] diane: So cute. 

[00:46:03] Steph Fizer Coleman: Yeah. I, um, you know, I’ve found with my sketchbook practice again, like I, you know, I get uptight like anyone does, um, or like myself, I get up tied like myself. Um, so for me it’s really good to switch materials and, you know, switch brushes and try different things. Um, like, like this one I was drawing, um, I have some, I think these are ecoline liquid water colors, like the bottles.

[00:46:28] diane: Mm-Hmm mm-Hmm. And the 

[00:46:29] Steph Fizer Coleman: bottles come with [00:46:30] a little dropper, so just drawing with the dropper, um, instead of like trying to use like a brush or, you know, a pen, like a stylus or anything like that. Um, and it just, it helps to just like, freshen things up and loosen things up and keep you from feeling like, oh, I have to draw this exactly as it is.

[00:46:47] Um, it just, you know, I, I would honestly say that like. I don’t even know. Probably like. 80% of my sketchbook is just like messy stuff. Those are so cute. And [00:47:00] then maybe like, like 20% of my sketchbook is like stuff that I would be like, yes, I would hang this on my wall or like I would, you know, sell this and like, it would be fine.

[00:47:09] Um, but yeah, most of it’s just messy. 

[00:47:11] diane: So like these, are you working out these for a book or are these just you playing? 

[00:47:19] Steph Fizer Coleman: So this is, um, from my polar bear sketchbook. 

[00:47:24] diane: I love this. 

[00:47:26] Steph Fizer Coleman: I honestly don’t know how this happened. Um, I was just, [00:47:30] I, I, I think that I had some paint ’cause I, I started the polar bear sketchbook in 2021.

[00:47:37] It’s not finished yet. Um, I still have maybe like a quarter of the book left to go. Um, but I think I just had some green paints that I got and I was like, I’m gonna do something with this. And I had a new sketchbook. And what came out was like a negative space, polar bear with a green background. And I was like, oh, this is fun.

[00:47:55] I like this guy. So then I just thought like, whoa, just, I’ll just keep drawing [00:48:00] polar bears. And at first it was the, it was this character, like this, the same polar bear, just in different, you know, places and doing things. And then as it’s gone over, you know, three years now, I will just try different things, you know, or just try like, like, you know, different, different materials.

[00:48:17] Like the, this one on the left is um, uh, an ink tense block that I broke in half and dipped in water and used it to create the shape of the polar bear, like the negative space around it. Mm-Hmm. Um, and then on the other side I [00:48:30] used, um, ink and my little, um, my little halfie paintbrush that you were mentioning earlier.

[00:48:36] I have a paintbrush that I actually cut it intentionally. I cut the handle in half. Um. Just ’cause I was, I just, again, I needed something new. So I wanted, I sometimes, and I highly recommend this, you know, sometimes when something feels weird in our art, we think to ourselves, I need to go buy something. I need, I need a new color paint.

[00:48:59] I need a new brush. I [00:49:00] need, I need that thing that that other artist is using that works so well for them. And then you get it and you’re like, oh, it doesn’t really, it’s not that great for me. Um, so instead I’ve tried to get in the habit of. Just looking at what I have and seeing what I can do. So in this case, I was like, well, I’d like to have a little bit less control and I don’t wanna buy like a long handled brush.

[00:49:21] Um, ’cause it just doesn’t work for like my sketchbook. It’s, I’m, I’m five four. I’m not that far away from my desk. You’re tall to 

[00:49:29] diane: me. [00:49:30] Yeah. 

[00:49:31] Steph Fizer Coleman: Like I draw standing up, um, like with my desk lower down, but still like a long handle brush wouldn’t work. So I was like, oh, let’s just try to, you know, grab the pliers and cut this brush in half.

[00:49:41] And it’s awesome. I love that brush. I’ve actually lost it. I was like digging through my studio, like, and I have like a neat studio. How did I lose it? Like, I was like combing through everything. I’m like, where’s my half brush? Like where’s it at? Did you find it? You did not find it yet. I don’t wanna do another one though.

[00:49:59] [00:50:00] Um, I don’t, I don’t wanna hurt another one unless I have to. Um, but I will. ’cause I love it. It’s just. It’s just so fun. Like, it’s just so fun. Um, so yeah, I’m just gonna, 

[00:50:11] diane: so like this, I this in this, like what happens to these experiments or studies after, like, ’cause the polar bear, is it because it’s not, I know the sketchbooks not finished.

[00:50:25] You’re can, you’re going back to it, but is there, is that a story [00:50:30] you’re creating or a character you’re creating or is. How do you know? 

[00:50:35] Steph Fizer Coleman: It’s, it’s, it’s almost at this point just like a comfort thing, like the birds are, um, just that I’ve, you know, I’ve filled up two thirds, well, no, probably three quarters of the sketchbook with different polar bear, um, you know, sketches and illustrations and different, you know.

[00:50:51] Ways. So I feel really comfortable drawing them. And I know that if I am, you know, having a crappy art day, [00:51:00] or I just wanna draw something really quickly, this is a good way to do that. Know, I know that I can just show up and fill up a couple pages of this and it’ll feel really nice. Um, and who knows, like, may, maybe one day this is a story for a kid’s book, and then I’ll, you know, that’s, that’s the thing about your sketchbook is that like so often, like I will look back through my sketchbooks and I will see like the little breadcrumbs of an idea that became a thing, or like a shift in my style or the shift in the way I see [00:51:30] things.

[00:51:30] And I didn’t know it at the time. I didn’t know. Like sometimes you do, sometimes you do something and you’re like, oh, this is a thing and you get this big zang, but sometimes you don’t even really notice it. And it just kind of, you know, it just kind of passes you by and it suddenly gets like, worked into the way that you create art and you flip back through and you’re like, oh, like this started like two years ago.

[00:51:51] Like, you’re like, I thought that I just like, just came up with this. But now I can see, you know, like the, the journey from this little like [00:52:00] mistake that turned into like, you know, something that is, is really lovely now. So that’s 

[00:52:05] diane: part of the sketchbook. But have you ever seen Emma Carlisle her sketchbook?

[00:52:09] She know she does like this. Yeah, I would, I would buy that. I would, I have i’s my, my Christmas present. My sister always gives me, I was like that. I would love that as, I mean, it’s not even a story, it’s just your sketchbooks. Anyway, I would, I would like to have that on my show 

[00:52:29] Steph Fizer Coleman: [00:52:30] maybe one day. 

[00:52:31] diane: Anyway, it’s cool ’cause I like to see the, the.

[00:52:35] Way you’re making marks and how you’re drawing the same thing but different. And anyway, it’s neat. So one question was about scenes. Do you ever work in your sketchbook in scenes or complete compositions? ’cause sometimes people, some people in the series, they finish a piece in their sketchbook and they might do a little bit of [00:53:00] digital work, but it’s not, it puts a lot of pressure on me.

[00:53:03] But some of these seem like, I love that little mouse. Oh, I know. Super cute. 

[00:53:08] Steph Fizer Coleman: He’s cute. He’s, he’s a favorite everywhere. He’s gonna have to be in a book one day, I think. Yeah, he’s a favorite. Um, I very rarely do scenes, um, in my sketchbook. It just, I think that a lot of that is because I was a digital illustrator first, and I just don’t think [00:53:30] that I have like that tendency to feel like I need to have like a completed anything Mm-Hmm.

[00:53:36] In my sketchbook. Um, it’s more common for me to do like what you see here where I just like fill up a page with like mushrooms or bugs or little flowers, like birds. 

[00:53:45] diane: The top two seem like scenes though, so sometimes, yeah. 

[00:53:49] Steph Fizer Coleman: Yeah. Like sometimes, but like, it’s, it’s very rarely my intention, uh, to, not that I don’t, I mean, you know, we, we’ve already seen things in here that are more [00:54:00] scenes, um.

[00:54:01] This is, so this is from my abstract sketchbooks that I started. Mm-Hmm. And those are more like little, like abstract landscapes. And I think that they tend to be more, you know, like completed things with like backgrounds and whatever. Um, but with kids book stuff, yeah. Those are 

[00:54:18] diane: beautiful. 

[00:54:19] Steph Fizer Coleman: Yeah. Like with kids book stuff, I don’t really, um, yeah, I don’t, I I’m just, I’m, I don’t wanna say I’m lazy ’cause that sounds negative.

[00:54:27] It’s just, you know, I know that [00:54:30] with my illustration work, I’m gonna do like the assembling part in Photoshop. So I know that my sketchbooks are really just like mining for like, ideas and textures and color combinations and layers and, and shapes. Um, and just like ways of being looser and more expressive and, you know, freer than I would be if I was just still drawing everything in Photoshop.

[00:54:55] Um, which like, no shame if you do that. Like, that’s awesome. But I just, it wasn’t, it wasn’t for [00:55:00] me anymore, you know? 

[00:55:01] diane: So you also date everything. Why is that important for you? We do. 

[00:55:05] Steph Fizer Coleman: Um, you know, I just think that. Number one, it just kind of helps me kind of remember like where I was in my life when I was drawing this Mm-Hmm.

[00:55:16] Like, it kind of, it gives me context of like, you know, like what was happening, what was going on, how was I kind of feeling around this time? And I think that’s lovely, but I also think that it’s really just lovely to see the progression of your work. Mm-Hmm. You know, to be [00:55:30] able to look back and be like, oh gosh, like this was 2019 and like, you know, I loved this so much, but now I see like how much I’ve grown.

[00:55:37] Um, it’s even like going through all my sketchbooks. And taking all the photos for these slides was really interesting because I, I really got to see how my art has changed over the last few years from when I started my software practice. These are, 

[00:55:51] diane: oh my gosh, I, these are like super stunner, love these, love these, love these, I love these two.

[00:55:59] Steph Fizer Coleman: I love these two. [00:56:00] Um, I’ve been, you know, like I said earlier, I’ve been sort of like dabbling in abstract stuff for like a few months. Um, and I keep like coming back to like these like flower ideas. Oh, damn. And then I’ll be like, gorgeous, I love this. This is so good. And then I’ll be like, oh, this can’t be anything.

[00:56:17] Oh my gosh, this, I can’t do anything with this. And then I’ll just, I’ll move on from it. I think 

[00:56:23] diane: that could be a pattern or a, um. Like a pottery barn could put that on their [00:56:30] next sheet. Set someone tell them, oh, I love these, 

[00:56:35] Steph Fizer Coleman: someone tell them. Um, I’m actually trying now to take these, uh, like these kind of flowers and like actually like paint them on paper.

[00:56:44] Um, I’m doing that like today, right over there. I’ve got a big piece of paper and I’m actually like taking it out of my sketchbook. Um, I’m doing some stuff with it, so 

[00:56:54] diane: that’s nice. Those are gorgeous. Okay, so one question. Um. [00:57:00] Uh, that I had, um, that now I can’t remember what it was, but, um, uh, what, oh, it was returning to the, your sketchbooks because you, you Mm-Hmm.

[00:57:10] Brought out, and you actually talk about this in some of either your newsletter or in your course, or like, I know I’ve heard you say this, maybe it’s just even, but I think sometimes maybe people forget to go back and it is something that you do. How often do you go back for mining some of that [00:57:30] gold, or even just to say, oh, I, that wasn’t as bad as I thought it was.

[00:57:35] Steph Fizer Coleman: Yeah. Um, I usually go back if I’m feeling stuck, you know, if I am. You know, if I’m having like a, just like a funky day where I’m just like, Ugh, like I don’t, ugh. You know, like everything’s just, ugh. Um, I’ll sometimes just sit down and flip through my sketchbooks. Um, and that’s, you know, that’s really helpful.

[00:57:56] Um, sometimes, like if I’m, you know, maybe I’m working [00:58:00] on a book idea or I wanna work on a painting or an illustration, I’m like, oh, I did a thing. I remember doing the thing and then I have to get out, like my whole stack of sketchbooks, like start flipping through them. I’m like, where is it? And it’s always in the last one, like every time, every time.

[00:58:15] Um, but I would say probably like, at least once a month I lived through them. You know, it’s just nice to, I’ve, I’ve found like over the years. That like it’s nicer for me to like [00:58:30] connect with my own art and like scroll through my own art than it is for me to be on Instagram. Like if I find that I’m on like Instagram scrolling for like inspiration, or if I’m on Instagram and I’m looking at other people’s art and it’s making me feel a way that isn’t like.

[00:58:47] Nice. Then I’m like, okay, like you need to go look at your own art. So you need to, you need to look at your sketchbooks. You need to, I have, um, a folder on my computer where I keep illustrations that I really like, so I [00:59:00] can go back and look at those and just sort of like, you know, be connected with what I’m making instead of like, you know, being inundated with it.

[00:59:08] I love that. Everyone else, 

[00:59:09] diane: it’s awesome. 

[00:59:09] Steph Fizer Coleman: Discuss. I love that idea. 

[00:59:11] diane: Okay, so then what is next? I’m, I, I wanna, I’m gonna read off these, your links and just so everybody knows, they’re always at the top. If you’re on YouTube, it’s the top things and the more, um, are all these links. And if you’re listening wherever you get your podcast, it’s also, you should have been watching.

[00:59:29] But [00:59:30] anyway, uh, but there were pictures. All these links. Yeah, all these links are right at the top, but everybody who’s here live is getting the links in the chat. But what’s next? So I know you’re doing the, Hey, let’s make picture books. Mm-Hmm. What else is, so also you. Authoring, is that another next, or tell us what else is next 

[00:59:48] Steph Fizer Coleman: maybe?

[00:59:49] Um, that’s one of my next is I’m trying to author illustrate some picture books. Um, I’ve got, I’m working with my agent. Um, we, we came up, I pitched her some [01:00:00] ideas. We picked like three of them that we really liked and then I’m working on one of them right now. Um. It’s hard. I picked like the, I picked the one that I thought was gonna be the easiest to write because the words are very simple.

[01:00:13] It’s just a couple words on each page and woo hoo. That is harder than I thought it was gonna be. So, so, um, that’s definitely a project that I am like constantly like picking up and putting down. Like I pick it up for a couple days and then I get to a funky spot and I’m like, okay, just put it down and let it just [01:00:30] marinate in your brain.

[01:00:31] It’ll figure itself out. Um, but yeah, I’m working on that. Um, I have the, let’s make picture books workshop that’s coming up, um, in the fall. Um, and I just had, um, a meeting with a book editor a couple of days ago and I might be developing a book about like messy fun art practice. Mm-Hmm. We’ll see. Like what, so what, 

[01:00:54] diane: what about the 

[01:00:54] Steph Fizer Coleman: abstract?

[01:00:55] We’ll see. So 

[01:00:55] diane: we’ll see. I mean, I want you to pursue this. I want you to get those things [01:01:00] on pottery, art creep. Like I, 

[01:01:01] Steph Fizer Coleman: it 

[01:01:02] diane: is, I’m going to gorgeous. 

[01:01:04] Steph Fizer Coleman: I’m going to. Um, so I, I have a separate Instagram account for my abstract practice. Um, it’s at SF SFC paints. Um, just ’cause I wanted it to have its own little nook and I wanted to have some accountability.

[01:01:18] Um, I don’t love Instagram anymore than anyone else does, but like, it’s just nice to have like a little internet corner where you can be like, look, I’m doing a thing. Like, here’s, here’s a place where I can just like tuck it all in [01:01:30] there. Is that correct? 

[01:01:31] diane: Did I write SFC paints? Is that, yeah. 

[01:01:34] Steph Fizer Coleman: I, I think that’s it.

[01:01:35] There might be an underscore. I don’t think so. I don’t know. I’ll go there. It’ll s it’ll be in there. It might just not be the 

[01:01:42] diane: live people. They’ll get the, um, 

[01:01:43] Steph Fizer Coleman: oh, Troy did it. Thank you, Troy. 

[01:01:45] diane: Oh, thank you Troy. Oh yeah. 

[01:01:48] Steph Fizer Coleman: Um. It’s, um, I’m gonna do something with it. Um, I, I’ve just, I’ve had like almost a year now on and off of like, experimenting with like these, these bold [01:02:00] florals and different ways of painting abstracts, and I’m just now kind of figuring out like, okay, this is what I like, these are the colors I like, and the transparencies and the layering and all these things.

[01:02:10] Um, so I’ll do something with it. You know, it’s, it’s like a, it’s like a side project, you know, for right now. But I’m excited about it and it feels really just like, it’s, it feels really good to be doing this kind of like work that doesn’t have to, you know, like. Kids books, even like, as fun as it is, like, you know, a thing has to look like a [01:02:30] thing and in abstract it doesn’t, so I can draw the weirdest flowers I want, I can draw the weirdest landscapes.

[01:02:37] I can just smudge paint on pages and it’s just, ah, it’s, it’s, it’s a relief, honestly. Like, it just, it feels like so good. So, 

[01:02:45] diane: but it also goes to the, so everybody can join your, uh, newsletter and this week I think in the newsletter was about just this honest stuff about, um. Kids books, picture books, but also you talk about income streams.

[01:02:59] And I [01:03:00] think that we do, we do have these side projects and hopefully they can, some of them will lead to some, some things that are, um, you know, will bring in some money, but some things won’t. But you have to be trying different things so that you’re diversified, which I love. I love the honesty in the business side that you’re sharing, but I also just love the way you draw and I love the way you teach, but I just really love that you’re like.

[01:03:27] Super honest, but hey, you can’t just put all your [01:03:30] eggs in the, you know, children’s book Illustrator basket and think you’re, I wish you could, I wish you could. I wish so too, but I think, I wish you could, but that’s something I really appreciate and admire that you are sharing just even on your, um, on your, on your website, on your newsletter.

[01:03:46] And I just wanna make sure everybody knows where they can go. If you’re listening, you just are like, just gimme the details. Diane. The artists with an s greenhouse. Mm-hmm. Dot com. And then on YouTube there are two different [01:04:00] YouTube channels, which I think I only got one, but I’ll get the other. Yeah, 

[01:04:03] Steph Fizer Coleman: there’s just one.

[01:04:04] diane: Oh, there is just one. Okay. So there’s just one, the one channel, it is linked, the second link down, it’s all these weird letters. I don’t know why when I got copied it, it just didn’t, um, give me really nice letters. Anyway, so it’s just, it’ll be the second link. And then Instagram, there are three Instagrams then?

[01:04:22] Correct. So there’s the artist or just artist with an S again? Greenhouse Artist. Greenhouse. And then [01:04:30] Steph Fizer Coleman. And then. Um, on Pinterest. Two s in paints? Yes. And then FSS as in Sam or Steph F as in Fizer and then Coleman C and then underscore, yeah. Paints with an S at the end there. But also check out her Pinterest.

[01:04:50] Um, I love ’cause you have a class, uh, or, or a workbook. Mm-Hmm. That’s about Pinterest as well for artists, which I think is great. Um, I got that and [01:05:00] just, it’s nice. I love Pinterest. I use Pinterest and then you’re talking about how we can use it and I just like Pinterest and we don’t give it enough. I dunno.

[01:05:11] Steph Fizer Coleman: We don’t, we don’t love Pinterest food. I know, but I It does a lot of work for 

[01:05:14] diane: artists. It does. It really does. So, and on Pinterest, it’s just pinterest.com/the artist with an S at the end of Artist Greenhouse and, Mm-Hmm. Steph thank you so much, so much. Thank you. I loved all [01:05:30] the stuff you showed. I still love the pairs.

[01:05:32] I have a pear tree that’s just busting out right now. I did not draw as cool a pairs, but I drew some pairs the other day. Yay. I know. So anyway, I appreciate it. Thank you just for the inspiration for being honest, and I can’t wait to have you back and I just love your sketchbook, so thank 

[01:05:51] Steph Fizer Coleman: you so much for having me.

[01:05:53] It was so fun to talk to you. 

[01:05:54] diane: It was great talking to you. And I’m sorry if I interrupted too much. I don’t think 

[01:05:58] Steph Fizer Coleman: you did at all. [01:06:00] 

[01:06:00] diane: Well, I, you’ll see a theme a little bit in from this week to next week. Next week I have. April Howlet, who is monkey mean? aka uh, and she draws a lot of birds. She knew who you were, Steph and I was like, who knew her work?

[01:06:16] I, so she is next week she is also gonna show you lots of birds, but she also does a lot of landscapes as well and uses a lot of the same, um, tools. But I am excited that we are doing this sketchbook. She uses her [01:06:30] sketchbooks differently than stuff, and I’m just thankful that we get to try something. So I hope for all of you that you go out there and that you just try to make some marks this week, even if it’s just five minutes or 10 minutes while you’re brushing your teeth or something, you know, just make some marks because it’s so much more fun and it makes our life better.

[01:06:51] Steph thank you so much and I will see all y’all next week. 

[01:06:56] Steph Fizer Coleman: Thank [01:07:00] you.